Arborwayfan wrote: ↑Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:31 pm Contact tracing does not have to be digital recording of people's movements via electronic device. The classic form of contact tracing is having people (the contract tracers) interview each person who is diagnosed and find out who they spent time with and sometimes what congested public spaces they spent time in in the previous x days. And then getting in touch with those contacts, advising them to quarantine for a while and get tested, and sometimes asking them who they have spent time with. This is what happens as work when one of us tests positive. With a disease like Covid-19, which you're not very likely to catch while walking past someone on the street, this method is probably enough to keep small outbreaks small -- even if a few people refuse to answer and even though most people don't know the names of absolutely everyone they have spent some time near. I think there are already US and/or state laws about keeping contact-tracing information -- like census answers -- out of the hands of other parts of the government, and we could reasonably tighten those up. That's not going to satisfy people who just don't want anyone knowing where they've been and who they've been with, but it's a far cry from putting everyone's test results in a public database that everyone's phone can access.The only problem with that is that 74% of the people in NJ have refused to cooperate with the the contact tracers over the phone, and the state is heavily Democratic at that. After angrily referring to his constituents as "knuckleheads" even Murphy has given up on it. Compliance has actually decreased from 40%.
Railroad Forums
Travel Apprehensions, Anyone?
- Discussion related to Amtrak also known as the National Railroad Passenger Corp.
Moderators: GirlOnTheTrain, mtuandrew, Tadman
The only train that my wife and I have traveled on since I retired from Amtrak effective Dec 1, 2019 was steam hauled and two foot gauge - at the Wiscasset, Waterville & Farming ton Railway in Maine and that was in early Feb. 2020. After that the Coronavirus "hit the fan" - We decided there was no need to go anywhere but local close family visits, doctors appointments and necessary shopping with a few safe exceptions. I do volunteer work at a local railroad museum but a majority of the time I am there alone, when not alone we are masked. We are almost up at bat to receive for our first "jabs" as we are in the over 65 age bracket. Once we have had our second round and any needed waiting period we will consider such enjoyments as a dinner out and maybe a train day trip
For those awaiting vaccinations my 98 year old Mon received her second jab a week ago and had no side affects from either shot.
For those awaiting vaccinations my 98 year old Mon received her second jab a week ago and had no side affects from either shot.
I’m not going to risk passing out or suffocating from wearing one or TWO (Masks make the people around you substantially less likely to get infected--25-50% or so, depending on how close you are, whether/how the air is moving, etc. Lots of good studies have shown this with Covid 19 as with other coronaviruses and flus. Not just about 0.) pieces of fabric for 2+ hours that provide just about zero protection for/from me or anyone else.
) pieces of fabric for 2+ hours that provide just about zero protection for/from me or anyone else.Circulating the air is good and can make an inside space safer, but it's also possible for a steady stream of air to carry the virus further. I would not want to spend 2+ hours in a coach of unmasked people at 50% capacity.
It took me a while to wear masks comfortably. Sometimes the cloth would move in against my mouth when I took a deep breath while lecturing, so I was trying to get all my air through a piece of cloth the size of my mouth. I found that I could fit a zip tie into the two hems of my cloth mask, where it became a curved horizontal rib that held the middle of the mask out from my face and let me breath through the whole area of the cloth without trouble.
I am really worried that people will be unwilling to ride trains in a year or five years. Also that people will want huge suburban yards and basically dedensify so much that even more people have to drive than now.
All this is moot for me for a while, anyway, because I don't have a need to travel; I'd love to go see a bunch of people and places, but I know that going places increases my chances of getting infected and infecting other people, and every new infection increases the chance of a new mutation in the virus, and so I wont go anyplace very far away; two or three hours by car to go backpacking (an almost 0 risk activity because no one else is around).
Arborwayfan wrote: ↑Sat Feb 20, 2021 9:09 pmI’m not going to risk passing out or suffocating from wearing one or TWO (Masks make the people around you substantially less likely to get infected--25-50% or so, depending on how close you are, whether/how the air is moving, etc. Lots of good studies have shown this with Covid 19 as with other coronaviruses and flus. Not just about 0.
Circulating the air is good and can make an inside space safer, but it's also possible for a steady stream of air to carry the virus further. I would not want to spend 2+ hours in a coach of unmasked people at 50% capacity.
It took me a while to wear masks comfortably. Sometimes the cloth would move in against my mouth when I took a deep breath while lecturing, so I was trying to get all my air through a piece of cloth the size of my mouth. I found that I could fit a zip tie into the two hems of my cloth mask, where it became a curved horizontal rib that held the middle of the mask out from my face and let me breath through the whole area of the cloth without trouble.
I am really worried that people will be unwilling to ride trains in a year or five years. Also that people will want huge suburban yards and basically dedensify so much that even more people have to drive than now.
All this is moot for me for a while, anyway, because I don't have a need to travel; I'd love to go see a bunch of people and places, but I know that going places increases my chances of getting infected and infecting other people, and every new infection increases the chance of a new mutation in the virus, and so I wont go anyplace very far away; two or three hours by car to go backpacking (an almost 0 risk activity because no one else is around).
Just out of curiosity, do you think the government will ever allow people to travel without masks, or will that 5% chance of getting a mild case of covid after vaccination be just too much trauma to ever allow unmasked travel again? I'm serious about this as Dr. Fauci has been vaccinated and still won't see his children without a mask because---5%.
It's going to be like asia where you have people wearing masks to deal with unsanitary conditions, disease, and pollution. I don't mind wearing a mask unless I am exerting myself or it is above 75 or so degrees. Shopping in a climate-controlled supermarket it isn't a problem. And remember we have UK and South African variants, annual influenza, common colds, pneumonia etc. Russia just reported a brand-new H5N8 avian flu today, so far limited to 7 poultry workers and mild symptoms. I'm avoiding transportation until I get my second vaccination (20:1 reduction in risk) and will still wear a mask (about 2:1 reduction in risk) because 5%==>2.5%. I know my mask isn't ideal because I can still smell strong odors like flowers. I will strongly prefer transportation that treats their recirculated air with ultraviolet rays. I'm also avoiding restaurants, bars, and public toilets when possible.
WashingtonPark wrote: ↑Sun Feb 21, 2021 2:25 pm Just out of curiosity, do you think the government will ever allow people to travel without masks, or will that 5% chance of getting a mild case of covid after vaccination be just too much trauma to ever allow unmasked travel again? I'm serious about this as Dr. Fauci has been vaccinated and still won't see his children without a mask because---5%.Once we get herd immunity (75%-80% of the population vaccinated) I think we'll get the "mask off" order. Not until then.
75%, will we ever get there?
All too many Fox, Newsmax, and religious cults telling their disciples - "don't".
That will be a tough barrier to attain. The Israeli idea of having a "health passport" that anyone must present to enter a public venue is one thing for a small country that knows what the word "discipline" means. Many "occurrences" over here during the past year have shown that word is simply not in our lexicon.
All too many Fox, Newsmax, and religious cults telling their disciples - "don't".
That will be a tough barrier to attain. The Israeli idea of having a "health passport" that anyone must present to enter a public venue is one thing for a small country that knows what the word "discipline" means. Many "occurrences" over here during the past year have shown that word is simply not in our lexicon.
Gilbert B Norman wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 7:27 am 75%, will we ever get there?Denmark and Spain are also entertaining that idea, and the airlines are already standardizing on the "CommonPass" platform to provide that "YES! I'M PROVABLY VAX'ED!" status.
All too many Fox, Newsmax, and religious cults telling their disciples - "don't".
That will be a tough barrier to attain. The Israeli idea of having a "health passport" that anyone must present to enter a public venue is one thing for a small country that knows what the word "discipline" means. Many "occurrences" over here during the past year have shown that word is simply not in our lexicon.
Add in an Executive Order for Amtrak and airlines, federal and state government buildings, with a reasonable accommodation clause, and you got the diehards throwing cash at lawyers for a lost cause.
We'll get to 75%, or we'll know who to blame.
NH2060 wrote: ↑Sat Feb 13, 2021 1:22 am Until Amtrak lifts their mask mandate I won’t be traveling with them. I’m not going to risk passing out or suffocating from wearing one or TWO (Is this a thing? I haven't heard of anyone passing out or suffocating from wearing a mask! And I know an OR nurse who often wears one for 8-10 hours straight (and he says the rest of the OR staff does as well).
Rbts Stn wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 3:13 pmI have three in the family that have to do that, and they absolutely hate wearing one when they're on their own time. I have first hand knowledge of an amusement park near me that wouldn't open until 6:30 at night during the summer because they had two of the workers pass out while working in the afternoon with the masks. In the heat and with bad allergies it is definitely miserable and (I believe) unhealthy. Or you could be like my mother who lived the last 18 years of her life terrified of getting a germ and ruined any quality of it she had left. Once the vaccine is widely available (getting my second dose soon) I would rather enjoy being with people without wearing a mask and take the risk that I may catch a cold, something I've been doing for over 65 years. Until this stops I'll be driving my car if I go anywhere.NH2060 wrote: ↑Sat Feb 13, 2021 1:22 am Until Amtrak lifts their mask mandate I won’t be traveling with them. I’m not going to risk passing out or suffocating from wearing one or TWO (Is this a thing? I haven't heard of anyone passing out or suffocating from wearing a mask! And I know an OR nurse who often wears one for 8-10 hours straight (and he says the rest of the OR staff does as well).
The more I think about it maybe the reason I have so little apprehension about traveling is because the pandemic has made me realize I hate where I live and besides my job there's nothing keeping me here.
Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
Rbts Stn wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 3:13 pmTry breathing in a mascot costume for 4 hour stints. A double-layered cloth mask is nothing in comparison. And yes, I've wore that traveling to conventions.NH2060 wrote: ↑Sat Feb 13, 2021 1:22 am Until Amtrak lifts their mask mandate I won’t be traveling with them. I’m not going to risk passing out or suffocating from wearing one or TWO (Is this a thing? I haven't heard of anyone passing out or suffocating from wearing a mask! And I know an OR nurse who often wears one for 8-10 hours straight (and he says the rest of the OR staff does as well).
But then... I'm stylish in a mask.
(raaarrr)WashingtonPark wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:10 pmI can see it being awful outside in the sun. But most folks don't have to stand outside in the sun for 8-10 hours with a mask on.Rbts Stn wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 3:13 pmI have three in the family that have to do that, and they absolutely hate wearing one when they're on their own time. I have first hand knowledge of an amusement park near me that wouldn't open until 6:30 at night during the summer because they had two of the workers pass out while working in the afternoon with the masks. In the heat and with bad allergies it is definitely miserable and (I believe) unhealthy. Or you could be like my mother who lived the last 18 years of her life terrified of getting a germ and ruined any quality of it she had left. Once the vaccine is widely available (getting my second dose soon) I would rather enjoy being with people without wearing a mask and take the risk that I may catch a cold, something I've been doing for over 65 years. Until this stops I'll be driving my car if I go anywhere.NH2060 wrote: ↑Sat Feb 13, 2021 1:22 am Until Amtrak lifts their mask mandate I won’t be traveling with them. I’m not going to risk passing out or suffocating from wearing one or TWO (Is this a thing? I haven't heard of anyone passing out or suffocating from wearing a mask! And I know an OR nurse who often wears one for 8-10 hours straight (and he says the rest of the OR staff does as well).
And I've seen those conventions, Wolf, on visits to Pittsburgh. Great and friendly folks!
Rbts Stn wrote: ↑Tue Feb 23, 2021 3:32 pmAnd evidently the ones who are required to wear one inside 8-10 hours a day don't want to wear one when they're off the clock. I've had medical professionals tell me that if you ever go to OR and everybody is wearing those blue paper masks get off the table and run as if it's not N-95 with a face shield it's basically worthless. Seriously, I wonder if there are others like me who will drive until this stops, if it ever does, and listening to Fauci rambling on I think there's a good chance it doesn't, even after vaccines. If it's causing that behavior among many people then so much for going green.WashingtonPark wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:10 pmI can see it being awful outside in the sun. But most folks don't have to stand outside in the sun for 8-10 hours with a mask on.Rbts Stn wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 3:13 pmI have three in the family that have to do that, and they absolutely hate wearing one when they're on their own time. I have first hand knowledge of an amusement park near me that wouldn't open until 6:30 at night during the summer because they had two of the workers pass out while working in the afternoon with the masks. In the heat and with bad allergies it is definitely miserable and (I believe) unhealthy. Or you could be like my mother who lived the last 18 years of her life terrified of getting a germ and ruined any quality of it she had left. Once the vaccine is widely available (getting my second dose soon) I would rather enjoy being with people without wearing a mask and take the risk that I may catch a cold, something I've been doing for over 65 years. Until this stops I'll be driving my car if I go anywhere.NH2060 wrote: ↑Sat Feb 13, 2021 1:22 am Until Amtrak lifts their mask mandate I won’t be traveling with them. I’m not going to risk passing out or suffocating from wearing one or TWO (Is this a thing? I haven't heard of anyone passing out or suffocating from wearing a mask! And I know an OR nurse who often wears one for 8-10 hours straight (and he says the rest of the OR staff does as well).
And I've seen those conventions, Wolf, on visits to Pittsburgh. Great and friendly folks!
Gilbert B Norman wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 7:27 am 75%, will we ever get there?Whole heartedly agree - with the anti Vaxxers out there it will be tough to get to that 75%.
All too many Fox, Newsmax, and religious cults telling their disciples - "don't".
That will be a tough barrier to attain. The Israeli idea of having a "health passport" that anyone must present to enter a public venue is one thing for a small country that knows what the word "discipline" means. Many "occurrences" over here during the past year have shown that word is simply not in our lexicon.