The Rumored End of the MMA?

How much money does the Derby shop generate in rebuilds for outside companies?

Rumor has it that the MM&A has filed for bankruptcy.

One of the things I've brought up occasionally both in this forum and in the VIARail forum is the possible resurrection of the Atlantic Limited through Maine (the shortest distance between two points --- Montreal and Halifax --- being through the Pine Tree State). I am curious --- given that we're talking about what may be the demise of the MMA, how much of the Moosehead Sub and the Mattawamkeag Sub's revenue was derived from VIA's passenger service when they were under CPR ownership? There never was much local freight business along the two lines after the 1950s, so I'm wondering to what extent the leasing of the track for passenger trains kept them alive. I know it's a long shot, and I know VIA isn't in business to keep rail lines functioning, but might this not be a means to keep the MMA from going under? There are a lot of Mainers and Maritimers who'd like to see the train come back.

Bingham, is this rumor publicly known or some sort of inside information? If true, very sad.

False, for now.......... We should see by the end of the summer.

It's too bad, who would ever even want to buy them??

how much of the Moosehead Sub and the Mattawamkeag Sub's revenue was derived from VIA's passenger service when they were under CPR ownership?

Virtually nil. Keep in mind, from the late 50s to the late 70s, the Atlantic Ltd averaged fewer than 50 passengers each way/day... and that's Maine AND Canada-Canada travelers. The increased costs and inconvenience associated with permitting a passenger train would hardly be worth the value any revenue derived from a trackage rights agreement. (The tracks would not be "leased" by VIA.)

Consider that it can cost $100s just to put a heavy train in the hole to clear a passenger train.

Also keep in mind that two custom stops in the post 9/11 era would be a major inconvenience for through travelers and slow the trip down. It is only about 7 miles shorter via the ex-CP from Halifax to Montreal (get a Canadian Trackside Guide and do the math) and that distance advantage wouldn't translate into faster transit times because of the grades, curves and track conditions of the route. Sure Saint John is off the Via network but when you look at it objectively, Saint John really isn't big enough to justify a passenger train.

VIA has NO interest in having a return of the atlantic,federal money is just not there nor is the passenger traffic it would be up to the MMA itself to start its own passenger service

Saint John and its size has nothing to do with this its solely dealing with customs twice vs a straight haul with the CN route

Cowford wrote:

from the late 50s to the late 70s, the Atlantic Ltd averaged fewer than 50 passengers each way/day... and that's Maine AND Canada-Canada travelers.

That wasn't my experience. I rode this train in both directions a number of times from the late 70's up until the very end, and it was nearly full every trip--many more than 50 persons. Also, I recall that when VIA dropped this train, it was stated in the media that this train had one of the heaviest loadings of all VIA trains.

Annual passenger count, by year, for last five calendar years of CP Rail operation, i.e., pre-VIA:

1973 - 16,216
1974 - 17,966
1975 - 17,648
1976 - 14,077
1977 - 14,725

Therefore, ave passenger count per train 1973 - 22 (16,216/2 trains per day) /365 days

Might have been higher under VIA but I doubt substantially so.

thebigham wrote:Rumor has it that the MM&A has filed for bankruptcy.

I doubt it, it would have been news in "Trains" and "Railway Age" by now!

There's actually a lot of truth in that. MMA has always been very quick to announce when they're laying people off or making other types of big changes, good or bad. If they had filed for bankruptcy, they probably would have announced it... and wouldn't they have to file with the STB and possibly other government entities?

If they can ride out this spring I think they can make another go at it. Millinocket might be back up soon too: http://www.bangordailynews.com/detail/101692.html

Reading the Bangor Daily News Article I just realized that biomass referred to burning wood waste products and not attempting to distill come type of alcohol fuel from them. Knowing the state of the lumber products industry right now I can't imagine that this plan wouldn't work, there are mills closing all over right now because of low demand for wood and fiber products.

Furthermore this plan would divert all of the funding previously spent on heat into the timber market in Maine which in of itself would be a major economic boost. Overall a very impressive effort. Perhaps there is hope for Millinocket after all, as well as other Maine based paper mills. If it goes in Millinocket I'm sure it will go elsewhere too.