The end of "railfan window" on Metro-North

Forget the fact that the M7's have full width cabs and therefore no railfan window, Metro-North has begun installing a bar on the last seat opposite the engineer's cab, where the door controls are located. The bar is extended when this is the head end car, blocking anyone from standing by the window. There is a sign on the bar stating something to the effect "restricted area, no one beyond this point"

UpperHarlemLine4ever wrote:Forget the fact that the M7's have full width cabs and therefore no railfan window, Metro-North has begun installing a bar on the last seat opposite the engineer's cab, where the door controls are located. The bar is extended when this is the head end car, blocking anyone from standing by the window. There is a sign on the bar stating something to the effect "restricted area, no one beyond this point"

I wish they had done that while I was working for them in the mid 1980's,
nothing worse than a crowd outside of the cab door blocking a possible
emergency opening for one reason or another.
Noel Weaver

On every train I work, if it has the bar, I pull it out for the Engr. I believe the safety of the crew comes before the chance to ogle out a window.

I just hope that this bar does not extend to where the water cooler is on the Shoreliner cars (which I presume are being what is mentioned here). However, I have yet to see it on any Shoreliner cab car, I, II, III, or IV.

This bar is being put on the M3's. I understand your concerns about exiting in an emergency but all you have to do is push on the door and anyone standing there will get out of the way, especially those engineer who kick the door open. I've seen some kids get knocked over when the door comes flying open. What will this do, delay you 3 seconds? There is a greater chance that if some calamity happens that the bar will come crashing through the car door and impale the engineer. Ever think of that?

Has this started happeneing on LIRR as well? Damn I was gunna get some rf window vids on m,nrr and lirr and now i cant , I remember once i had an engineer yall at me and my cousin for standing at the rf window.

Just a little anecdote on the subject:
An old time (now retired) LIRR Engineer, "Brooklyn Al", once told me that some Engineers would carry a chain to hook up between the little cleats that are over the seat backs behind and opposite the cab in the M-1. The cleats are apparently there for precisely that purpose. (Some are broken off.) He said they were within their right to refuse to move the train if anyone stepped into that chained off area, and would not leave if/when asked.
Take a look and see if the cleats are also on your M-1a and M-3a cars.
I'll bet they are.

Tom

P.S. Note to 4149: As of today, I know of no plans to put bars in LIRR cars...subject to change without notice, of course!

The railroad can do whatever it wants, but if they didnt want people near the front or the door controls, why is there a seat there?

-otto-

Otto Vondrak wrote:The railroad can do whatever it wants, but if they didnt want people near the front or the door controls, why is there a seat there?

-otto-

When the cab car is the "last car" on a train, the seats would be used.

I believe one of the people killed in the NJT Secaucus collision was sitting in the first row of pax seats, directly behind the engineer, in the cab car. Prob not a safe place to be (either)

Otto,

I'm on your side on this. I have been known to hang out and look out the railfan window on occasion. I don't like the lack of front window on the M-7/M-7a any more than you do.
Yes, as an employee, I have the edge that I can ask the Engineer, if I know him/her, if I can sit in the observer seat. I have yet to do that.

Tom

Bottom line is liability.
I have had people witness a suicide and then sue railroad for seeing it.
or parents getting upset cause a train hit Bambi and little johnny saw it.

GO Transit also blocks off seat access to the two rows of seats opposite the cab on their cab cars that are not full-width when in push mode as well. Normal practice there was that the engineer would keep the door to the cab propped open.

You still have an excellent view out the front window from behind the chain...just not condusive to taking pictures or video. Seems this will now be the case on the M1 and M3 fleet as well.

It also helps the M7's to seem like sardine cans.

Very Similar to the MBTA Blue Line 0600s and Red Line 01400s, they also had similar things to keep passengers out, although the 0600s are already full cabs and were always

I have seen a few LIRR engineers rig a chain like that described above. When I ride M-1/M-3's I usually stand at the first vestibule, so as not to be in the engineer's way. From there you can see straight out the front, and out the sides as well. Be aware that there are some railfan-friendly engineers. One actually invited me up to the window, and said some others wouldn't have a problem if you ask them nicely........

To answer Otto's question about why they even put seats opposite the cab. I believe that seat-set can be folded up against the bulkhead when necessary. It's only an issue in the head and rear cars. The seats can be used in the other cars in the middle of the train. I guess back in the pre-M-7 era, the planners actually designed the maximum number of seats possible for the passengers; imagine that ! Yes I know, that fewer seats in the M-7 is because of Federal requirements, etc, etc.......

Dutch; That's incredible re: people suing for being allowed to witness an accident ! On the other hand, a firefighter/railfan buddy of mine once witnessed such an incident while up front, and absolutely agreed that it was the trespasser's fault. He offered his name to the Railroad Police as a witness......