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  • Steam operations between Port Jervis and Graham

  • Discussion relating to the Delaware, Lackawanna & Western, the Erie, and the resulting 1960 merger creating the Erie Lackawanna. Visit the Erie Lackawanna Historical Society at http://www.erielackhs.org/.
Discussion relating to the Delaware, Lackawanna & Western, the Erie, and the resulting 1960 merger creating the Erie Lackawanna. Visit the Erie Lackawanna Historical Society at http://www.erielackhs.org/.

Moderator: blockline4180

 #1220704  by walterconklin
 
Hello,

I am trying to find out how realistically Open Rails Train Simulator, which is a successor to Microsoft Train Simulator, handles virtual steam locomotive operations. Testing out several steam locomotive models on the virtual Tristate route between Port Jervis and Graham using Open Rails has piqued my interest in the former steam locomotive operations between these select locations. The section of the virtual Tristate route between Port Jervis and Graham shall serve as a sort of test bed in concert with the acquiring of information pertaining to historical steam operations, which will help determine how realistically steam locomotive models function in Open Rails.

To help me reach my goal, I am researching about the historical steam operations between Port Jervis and Graham. I have a few related questions about the historical steam operations between these locations. I know that the Eire had pusher and helper steam locomotives stationed at Graham prior to the complete dieselization of the railroad.

Does anyone know, have historical information, or have an educated guess as to what types of trains and locomotives did the Erie use as helpers and pushers between Port Jervis and Graham?

How long/heavy would a train have to be to require a pusher and helper to conquer the Shawanqunk Ridge?

Did the Erie use helper locomotives to get the steam powered commuter trains over the Shawangunks?

Using Open Rails, which is a work-in-progress project, the Erie K2 and K5 models with about 4 or 5 pseudo Erie Stillwells cars stall at the base of the virtual Shawangunks near Port Jervis, which are based on actual Digital Elevation models. Similarly, an Erie Berkshire with a string of about 10 freight cars will stall near the same location. I do not know if the freight cars are loaded. I am surprised that the Erie Berkshire stalls so soon as I assume otherwise that the steam locomotive has considerable pulling power. I am running the locomotives with full throttle up the ridge.

It is exciting to have the opportunity to compare the performance of the Open Rails Train Simulator with real world, historical information.

Thank you for your time.

Sincerely,
Walter Conklin
 #1229846  by oibu
 
From earlier 1900s to 1930s or so, the 0-8-8-0 camelbacks served as helpers here. In later steam era, all classes of 2-10-2 and 2-8-2 could be found. Most all freight would have been helped eastboud, and occasionally wetbound as well. Long-distance passenger trains also got help (sometimes the smaller passenger power- K1s etc.- served in this role, but often it was the same power that helped the freights). I wouldn't think commuter trains would typicall yhave had help and whave not seen photos showing this, other than perhaps some very long/heavy ones or under severe conditions (i.e., heavy snow etc.). Pass trains got a head end helper, of course. Freight probably sometimes got a head end helper but usually on the rear, and often 2 engines pushed on the rear of freights (again, could be any combination - 2x 2-10-2, 2x 2-8-2, 1 each 2-10-2 + 2-8-2, etc.). The engines used as helpers typically would be members of each class that were equipped with short vanderbilt tanks (as opposed to those with 12-wheel road tenders), except of course in cases that had neither the vanderblt tanks nor largers tenders (such as the R-3 2-10-2s). At the end of steam espeically, BErkshires could also be found here in helper service. Head end freight road power post-1920s would have been largely the 2-8-4s, but also 2-10-2s, 2-8-2s, etc. Sometimes road power would be doubleheaded on heavy trains (in addition to whatever helpers were added on the grades). Recommend the book "Erie Power" by Stauffer/Westing for some pics of all this. Hope this helps.