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Moderator: lensovet

  by lensovet
lpetrich wrote:Will the Marina Say Yes to Muni This Time? - January 17, 2019 - SF Weekly, SFMTA Plans Marina Subway Extension – Streetsblog San Francisco -- it is expected to open late this year.

But there is already some discussions of future extensions, like to North Beach, Fisherman's Wharf, and the Marina District.
as i was confused - it is only the currently-being-built extension to chinatown that's expected to open this year, not the further extensions.
  by lpetrich
Sorry if what I wrote was confusing. :(

The to-be-active part of the line currently goes out to Chinatown, though its tunnel was built out to North Beach for convenience in extracting the TBM's.

I perused Google Maps's satellite pictures of northern SF, and a lot of the streets there are only two-lane. The Central Subway line is being built under Columbus Ave., and the best possibility for getting to the Marina District is Bay St., with its four lanes. Lombard St. is also four lanes near the Marina District, but near Columbus Ave., it gets down to two lanes, and it even has a block where it is a wiggle.
  by The EGE
Another delay announced today (Friday night news dump) - opening is now projected for the end of 2021. That means the odds are now good that the MBTA Green Line Extension will beat it to revenue service.
  by lensovet
FWIW the date was already pushed back to June 2021 in September 2019: https://www.sfexaminer.com/news/its-off ... n-planned/

Here’s the news that was posted on Friday: https://www.sfmta.com/blog/central-subw ... e-end-2021. Unclear if the pandemic had a hand in these delays.
  by lpetrich
That last one is very interesting. The line's under-construction stations:
  • 4th and Brannan Station at 4th and Brannan streets (street level)
  • Yerba Buena/Moscone Station at 4th and Folsom streets (subway)
  • Union Square/Market Street Station on Stockton Street at Union Square (subway)
  • Chinatown Station at Stockton and Washington streets (subway)
A tailtrack tunnel was built northward in Stockton St., turning NW in Columbus St. and ending near Washington Square.

The highest-polling locations:
  • Columbus Ave. & Greenwich St. - 2330 - North Beach / Telegraph Hill
  • Columbus Ave. & Bay St. - 2216 - North Beach / Russian Hill
  • Van Ness Ave. & Chestnut St. - 1123 - Russian Hill
  • Fillmore St. & Bay St. - 992 - Marina District
There were several others nearby that ranged from 582 to 743, and several others scattered over NE SF with smaller numbers.

The highest-polling locations suggest a line that continues in Columbus St., then turns west in Bay St. until the Marina District.
  by lpetrich
Central Subway Opening Marks a Milestone for San Francisco and Chinatown | KQED
The original line will run weekends between Chinatown-Rose Pak Station, and 4th and Brannan streets. On Jan. 7, however, the line will run its full course seven days a week, direct from Sunnydale, Bayview and Visitacion Valley all the way to SoMa, Union Square and Chinatown, extending the Muni Metro T-3rd Street line on 3rd Street.
The project went over budget, costing $2 billion, and it was completed four years behind schedule. It opened November 19.
But the political fight to bring the line to Chinatown was actually led by an unlikely and controversial figure after whom the Chinatown station was eventually renamed on Aug. 20, 2019: Rose Pak.
Central Subway Opens November 19 with Special Weekend Service | SFMTA

It will run only on weekends, and run only in the new stations: 4th & Brannan, Yerba Buena / Moscone, Union Square / Market St., and Chinatown - Rose Pak.

There's a gap of about 1,100 ft between 4th & King and 4th & Brannan.
  by lpetrich
Central Subway Project | SFMTA
On January 7, T Third Metro service will begin from Sunnydale to Chinatown via Central Subway, seven days a week, giving customers a direct connection from Bayview, Visitacion Valley and nearby neighborhoods to SoMa, Union Square and Chinatown.
T Third service is currently an extension of K Ingleside service, but on 2023 Jan 7, the Central Subway route will open to 4th & King, and it will become the northern end of T Third service. K Ingleside will likely revert to Embarcadero - Balboa Park.

Central Subway Extension | SFMTA does not have much, but Central Subway (San Francisco) - Wikipedia includes maps of possible extensions.
  1. North Beach / Washington Square on Columbus Ave.
  2. Columbus Ave. / Beach Ave. either directly or else north to Fisherman's Wharf then west to that destionation.
  3. Northeastern Presidio Park by any of
    • Beach St. - Marina Blvd.
    • Lombard St.
    • Union St.
  by lpetrich
SFMTA Rail Capacity Strategy | SFMTA - from 2014. Looking at the PDF document I find these plans:
  • Central Subway expansion
  • Geneva LRT: Balboa Park - Geneva Ave. - Bayshore Blvd. - Bayshore & Sunnydale T Third station.
  • M-line extension: from SFSU to SE Lake Merced. Also a tunnel in 19th St.
  • Geary Blvd LRT: Market St - Geary St./ O'Farrell St. - Geary Blvd. - Lands End
The Geary Blvd. one will be difficult, since it will either go under Market St. with its existing tunnels, or else it would connect to the Central Subway line.

The next tier is
  • West Portal - 19th Ave. - Presidio Park
  • Market St. - Webster Ave. - Fillmore Ave. - Marina
  • Market St. - Van Ness Ave. - Ft. Mason
  • King St. - 2nd St. - Market St. - Sansome St. - Broadway - Van Ness Ave.
  • N Judah line: extending the Sunset Tunnel westward from Carl & Cole Sts., to 9th Ave., where the existing line goes from Irving St. to Judah St.
  • Market St. - 16th St. - Mission Bay
  by lpetrich
Central Subway Project | SFMTA - the full line did indeed open on January 7 of this year, and the T Third line was rerouted into it from the Embarcadero Line and the Market Street Tunnel. So that line now runs Central Subway - Third Street Line.

Currently, only the N Judah line goes into the Embarcadero Line, ending at the Caltrain station. There is also a T Third station there, and one can transfer between the two lines there. One can also transfer at where the Central Subway crosses under Market Street.

I remember thinking that the Central Subway would be crossing above the BART/Muni-Metro Market-Street tunnel, at just below street level. I was a bit surprised to learn that the CS tunnel was to go under the BART/MM tunnel.
  by lensovet
Yeah remember that BART already runs under Muni. There is simply no space to put another mode of transit between that and the street; that tunnel was built with cut and cover methods and was not deep at all.