Rockland Branch Discussion

NHV 669 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 11, 2024 8:22 am An uninformed assumption that was made without even bothering to crunch numbers. The difference between a P42 and a B23-7 is roughly 5 tons, and a single loaded freight car would more than make up that difference. So a moot point.

There was necessary bridge work, but as noted above, either already done, or at least under contract/under bid.

I wouldn't necessarily say it's a moot point. The difference is the speed. When railroad bridges have issues, they receive speed restrictions. Walking a B23 or P42 over a bridge at 5 MPH creates less dynamic stress and less movement of bridge members than running over the bridge at MAS. When the deficiencies in these bridges were discovered, speed restrictions were put in place. Amtrak, understandably, didn't want to operate a service that required them to slow down to 5 MPH for multiple bridges. Operating like that is fine when you're a freight operator or even an excursion operator (you can sell it to tourists as "we're slowing down so you can get a better view of the water"), but it's not what Amtrak and NNEPRA have in mind for a service that they want to be time-competitive with driving.

The DOT did work on some the bridges at the end of CP, which involved rip rap around the abutments and miscellaneous structural work. For instance at the bridge in Warren they added more angle iron to help the granite blocks hold the right shape. Mid-Coast still had restrictions for loaded cars at Warren, Newcastle, and Bath. They had a 10 MPH restriction through Wiscasset as well but I am not sure if that had to do with the bridges.

Good to know. Thanks for the information, MaineRailfan.

MEC407 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 11, 2024 6:08 am I do think Bangor will happen someday, but it will require a big push from the public, similar to what it took to get the original Boston-Portland service going.

The obvious issue with getting to Waterville (which is a necessary stepping-stone to Bangor): you either have to split the service in Yarmouth, with some trains taking the Back Road (or even the GT as far as Danville) through Lewiston-Auburn, or you keep the existing pattern that just serves Brunswick, and then restore the Lower Road through Augusta. One covers the state's second-largest metro, but breaks the existing service pattern and probably serves the state capital via Winthrop, the other misses L-A but could serve the State House (and environs for hearings, etc.) almost directly via the foot of Capitol Park, but it would require more restoration to get going again.

The RFP is posted.

https://www.maine.gov/mdot/ofps/docs/Ro ... .20.24.pdf

Long term, pick one line as the main line, and the other line(s) get shuttle service (trains and/or buses). Or wait for self-driving cars and self-driving trains.

at this point i feel like amtrak downeasters to/from Rockland might be the best option. especially after dragon shutting rail shipments down.

CN9634 wrote: ↑Sat Sep 21, 2024 9:15 am The RFP is posted.

https://www.maine.gov/mdot/ofps/docs/Ro ... .20.24.pdf

From the linked document:

Operator must be committed to the success of scheduled passenger rail service between Boston, Portland and Brunswick and between Brunswick and Rockland, no matter who is operating these scheduled passenger rail services. In addition, Operator must be willing to agree at the outset to the contractual framework within which these services, if operated by others, will operate. Part of this contractual framework will be based on the proposals that are submitted in response to this Request for Proposals.

Also, this is interesting: the current Amtrak service concept on the branch:

The final AMTRAK schedule is subject to change, but the current proposed Amtrak 2-year pilot service includes the following trip schedules:
• Between Brunswick and Bath two times daily, Monday-Friday year-round to serve Bath Iron Works.
• Seasonal May-October two to three times per day Thursday-Sunday between Brunswick and Rockland.

This bit is interesting:

CSX has freight operating rights between Railway Mile 29.40 and Railway Mile 33.79
(east of Hardings Siding). A copy of the Freight Easement Agreement between and
among Maine Central Railroad Company, ST and the State of Maine is contained in
Appendix 3.

During Maine Coast or it might have been Safe Handling, I think they conducted the interchange at Hardings. I will ask a friend of mine who worked for both companies, I remember him mentioning something about swapping trains at Hardings when Maine Coast was moving solid trains of coke to Dragon.

Twice daily between Brunswick and Bath, to serve BIW? Where are those BIW commutters supposed to park? And who's going to detour to downtown Brunswick to wait for a train when you'd already be in Bath if you kept driving?

The BIW commutter idea is a pipe dream. Maybe if they were coming from Portland...

Pretty sure they mean existing trains will operate as far as Bath twice a day. Brunswick-Bath wouldn't even make sense.