Emergency in locomotive, What happens

Ok, so here's a hypothetical situation, What would the real world solution/implications be?

Were out in the middle of the nowhere and the engineer has a heart attack, based on my knowledge of the route there is no access to the area where we are, we just passed a clear signal and the next road crossing is under 2 miles away. The Engineer falls out of his seat and appears to be having a heart attack or going into diabetic shock. Do I.........

A. Radio For help and dump the air
B. Radio for help and explain to dispatch the situation and bring the train to a controlled stop at the next road crossing and alert them to have emergency personnel available
C. other options??????

I just can't fathom that we would be required to stop dead miles from assistance because I don't have a locomotive engineer card.

this has been bugging me for days now hopefully someone can help!!

-Kevin

I'm running the train til the nearest crossing where someone can help us. Don't know what the rule is, but I'm doing it.

Don't tell the dispatcher the engineer is out of seat, just tell them he needs medical attention at next crossing.
with you operating the train, now if he had a heart attack the chances are he won't make it unless a 3th person does CPR.
by rule its prohibited for anyone without a certificate to be in seat of operating controlling locomotive.

DutchRailnut wrote:Don't tell the dispatcher the engineer is out of seat, just tell them he needs medical attention at next crossing.
with you operating the train, now if he had a heart attack the chances are he won't make it unless a 3th person does CPR.
by rule its prohibited for anyone without a certificate to be in seat of operating controlling locomotive.

So I smack the alerter, give him some CPR, and put him in the seat at the crossing............the rule says he has to be in the seat..................

Check the seniority roster and see if it would advance my seniority by him dying.
Just kidding
in all seriousness to hell with the rules in an emergency you are empowered to do what ever is necessary to protect life and property

I have to agree... if it means saving someone's life. If you're in the middle of the wilderness what are you gonna do? Let the guy die? If not stopping at a grade crossing, at least adjacent to a road or a close to civilization.

This happened where I work. The crew had stopped for coffee at a convenience store. The line is on a grade separated fill through the city. The engineer walked down to the store and back. They got back, and the engineer started the train. He then had a heart attack and died. luckily it was just about .25 mi. before the passenger station. The train crew brought it in. The brakeman ran down to the agent to have him call for help.
I was the senior engineer cut off. i couldn't hold any brakeman jobs either. This got me called back, but believe me, I would rather be cut off than have this happen.

So, we're assuming that anyone on a train knows where he's at, how to get a train to a certain point, know where that point is and stop at that point. Obviously, we would like to try to get to where aid can be rendered, but there a lot of assumptions being made here. I work with a lot of guys that don't have a clue where they're at, much less how to get somewhere else.

That will change with the new conductor qualification rules (once the 'grandfathering' expires in 3 years, that is) ... anyone holding a conductor's card will be required to be similarly familiar with the territory as the engineer.

The new rules will require both a carded engineer and conductor to operate.

- litz

Did anyone call the Paramedics or at least the police dept. ??

pennsy wrote:Did anyone call the Paramedics or at least the police dept. ??

no you just pin name tag on him/her and leave it at crossing <sarcasm off>

Employee death while on duty, without supervisor's approval, is cause for disciplinary action and possible termination of employment.

roadster wrote:Employee death while on duty, without supervisor's approval, is cause for disciplinary action and possible termination of employment.

now that's funny

The FAA has a rule that allows deviation from the rules in the event of an emergency. Does the FRA have a similar rule? If not, I expect that a crew-member could rely on the common law emergency exception - called "necessity". E.g., it is a defense to a crime to break into someone's cabin if one is lost in the woods, and survival depends on shelter. (one would have to pay for the damages to the property of course) If a non-engineer qualified conductor operated the engine to get the engineer to a location for medical aid, that should not result in a fine or disciplinary action by the FRA. If it did, I can't see the US Court of Appeals upholding the FRA in that circumstance.

In a life-threatening emergency, you are allowed to do anything reasonable to save a life. You have a legal and moral obligation to do so.

You don't have an engineer's card, but I am assuming you are a railroad employee. Anyone in train service has to know how to stop a train in an emergency. If you have been riding the engine for awhile, you should have at least a rough idea of how to run it. The train is already moving, so you just have to get it to the next crossing. Unless you are in some sort of extreme track profile, the train should keep going if you just keep hitting the alerter button when the light starts to flash.

If you know how to stop the train properly at the crossing, go ahead and do so. Otherwise, that big red lever in front of you on your side of the cab is the emergency brake valve. When you pull it, several things will happen at once. The trainline pressure will drop to zero. All the cars' brakes will apply fully as the service reservoirs and emergency reservoirs dump their pressure into the brake cylinders.

If at all possible, get to the independent brake handle (the lower one) and depress it. The engine brakes will set up faster than the train brakes, and the slack will run in hard against the locomotives. You want to have the engine brakes released before this happens.

The "PC" light will come on the control panel. The engines will automatically go to idle. The generator field will drop. The sanders will come on. The train will not be able to be moved until the PC is reset, but you will not have to worry about that. Now you need to concentrate your attention on the engineer.

I hope you never find yourself in this situation.

Les