Atlas Forum Taking a Break

I notice there's been comment on Trainorders and here about the Atlas forum taking a summer break. My own view has been expressed on my site, and I was chatting about this with my local hobby dealer, who lurks on the Atlas forum with some frequency.

I pointed out that if they have to shut the thing down because Atlas employees are taking vacations, this means that Atlas employees are spending MAJOR time babysitting that forum. My LHD agreed. This is one indication that big bucks are being spent on that forum by Atlas.

Second is just the question of software license, bandwidth, cost of server, and so forth. I suspect it isn't cheap. Otto may be able to give a ballpark estimate of what Railroad.net pays per month for its forums.

So: if I pay whatever -- $80,. $100, $150, now $250 for an Atlas HO loco, what percentage of that pays for the Atlas forums? If Atlas shut down its forums and passed on the cost to modelers (or simply used the savings to keep prices at their current level), would we benefit?

Add that to the comments made on Trainorders about the Atlas forum -- the amount of flaming that's tolerated, for instance, especially from the posters who are "more equal than others" -- I can't help wondering if Atlas is spending these big bucks to give model railroading a bad rep. Wouldn't it be more peaceful, and maybe even more cost-effective for modelers, if Atlas sorta forgot to bring the forums back in August?

I think if Atlas was going to shutdown the forum for good, they would have just said so instead of saying they would be back in August.

I think we will see some new rules when it DOES come back, however!

I also see that the UP-ATHERN topic on THIS forum is just as hot (if not hotter!) than it was on the Atlas forum. At least one poster (and maybe more) on the thread here would have been banned if they posted the same comments on the Atlas forum!!

I don't think the forum costs Atlas as much as you might think. Computer equipment and etc, yes, but I don't think Paul and Rob spend THAT much time policeing.

I have participated actively in the present Atlas Forums (HO mostly, but also O and N) and their predecessors for years. I do enjoy writing. But I've also learned a great deal from other participants' posts.

It may be worth something to Atlas to answer one question on a forum where many others wondering about it may read it, rather than having to deal with many individual inquiries.

I would put the cost at $900.00 per month in total resources, IMO.

Those flame throwers were getting hotter & hotter. Needed a corporate
cool down.

Why are we discussiong the 'Why's and Why nots' of the Atlas Forum on this forum, I never saw this forum discussed on Atlas. It's a free service provided by them and they control the switch. In my opinion there is no discussing it. This type of discussion is probably why they took a break - politics - .

My opinion is that poorly run forums like the Atlas forum are bad for the hobby -- everyone seems to agree that the Atlas forum was "cooled down" for a reason. We've got one estimate that total resources spent by Atlas -- probably non-staff here -- run about $10K per year. That's for starters -- Atlas is spending this money in part to have a lot of flaming and bad language go out under their name. Publicity?

I think this is worth discussing. One suggestion I've made is that the NMRA provide a "ratings system" like the film ratings, but for model railroad forums. This would include actual model railroad content, level of flaming, poor grammar and spelling, etc. I think all this might make some in the hobby wake up to how bad a reputation the poorly run forums can potentially give the hobby.

I think hosting the forum is helpful for Atlas in that it keeps a large number of people logging onto their site each day. This is good advertising for them and, I imagine, the forum pays for itself with increased sales. It creates excitement for new products. They don't mind discussing products from other manufacturers because, in their view, a rising tide raises all boats.

The flaming, IMO, is a result of the large number of participants. The more popular the site the greater potential for conflict. As far as the grammar and spelling goes, I keep in mind that some participants do not live in the United States or another country where English is the native language. They do the best they can to participate. I have communicated with model railroaders from all over the world on that site.

I think it was shut down because of the discussion regarding the UP issue. They probably were advised by their attorneys that they could be liable for inaccurate information posted on their site, even if it is a message board.

I think a check would show that the worst examples of bad spelling and grammar on any forum are native-born North American English speakers. For some reason, UK, Australia, and NZ don't seem to have this problem -- and by and large non-native English speakers do quite well. I'm talking about posters that don't have their third-grade stuff together. This ought to concern any parent with children that might logon to the forum -- not just bad language, but bad example.

I would question as well -- and I would fault Atlas if they haven't thought about it -- that a lot of posters aren't in fact active modelers. I've seen this said more than once, that a lot of the real problem posters don't have layouts and don't do much modeling. So how can Atlas think they're going to sell product here?

I get the impression that most of the regulars at the Atlas forum have layouts. They post links to layout photos and track plans. Are there regular posters who don't have layouts? I've seen a few photos where people place scratch built locomotives and rolling stock in diaramas. I suppose there are others who don't have a home layout but are members of a club with a big layout. Is this what you mean or are you referring to people who present themselves as "know it alls" but really only have a subscription to Model Railroader and an EZ track oval around the Christmas tree?

The Atlas forum does get a lot of people building their first layouts. They ask questions like, "Should I buy sectional or flex track?" The good thing about that forum is that when a newcomer to the hobby posts a question there are usually three replies within fifteen minutes. This is what I like about that forum. What I don't like -- and this is one reason why I don't really participate on the forum -- is the flame wars and locked topics. Who ever thought model railroading could be so controversial? But my guess is that this is more a reflection of the sheer number of participants. I am sure that if a bulletin board made up of gardeners had over 1,000 participants there would be flame wars over what kind of fertilizer is the best and whether or not someone should use a watering can or a sprinklers system.

I'm confused... there are other forums???

-otto-

Let me break it gently, yes. For me, ATSF modelers, NCE-dCC forum, RPM forum among others.

Bob

Camelback wrote:I get the impression that most of the regulars at the Atlas forum have layouts. They post links to layout photos and track plans. Are there regular posters who don't have layouts?

I'm a reasonably regular poster over on the Atlas forum and I confess, I don't have a layout. I've had layouts in the past - three, actually. I've built many dioramas, too. I don't think I'm a know-it-all, but I do enjoy researching my favorite subjects to learn what I can. And I don't have a subscription to MR (or any other magazine) either.

I have two daughters; Emma is almost two and Madeline is almost one year old, so finances, space and time are not available for a layout. I'm not a member of a club anymore (I moved away from the town where I was a member), so the only social interaction I get with other model railroaders is at places like this. But, if there's any silver lining to the limited time, money and space I have for model railroading, it's the fact that I can work on building my collection of rolling stock and locomotives to populate my future layout.