• Passenger vs. Freight Priority. Was: DOJ sues Norfolk Southern for making Crescent late

  • Discussion related to Amtrak also known as the National Railroad Passenger Corp.
Discussion related to Amtrak also known as the National Railroad Passenger Corp.

Moderators: GirlOnTheTrain, mtuandrew, Tadman

  by ryanwc
 
I'm sympathetic to the idea that a different passenger rail system run by private companies might work better. But Tad's narrative on Amtrak reads as an inaccurate caricature based on my experience. Like Lord Sigma, I've ridden a fair number of Amtrak trains in the last several months, and have simply not had anything resembling what Tad describes.

Meanwhile, I have been gaslighted by airlines twice this summer with fake info about delays. I tend to think the profit motive works better. But elections do create competition*, and corporations do try to insulate themselves from competitive pressure and from accountability for their own mistakes, more successfully the larger they are. As far as responsiveness and service, airline staff are closer to Amtrak staff than they are to the servers at a local restaurant.

* This worked better when there were more swing voters and newspaper readers judging on competence, and fewer people watching their own partisan newschannels. But it still works.
  by west point
 
west point wrote: Tue Sep 24, 2024 9:14 pm
electricron wrote: Tue Sep 24, 2024 5:44 pm
Pennsylvania RR between NYC and DC hung 12kV 25 Hz power.

I believe you will find that PRR started with 11.0 kV. Sometime after WW-2 PRR went to 11.5 kV. Amtrak converted to 12.0 kV. That is nominal voltages with variation actually +/- 10 %. Loads will lower voltage while regeneration will increase voltages.
  by lensovet
 
ryanwc wrote: Tue Sep 24, 2024 8:05 pm But Tad's narrative on Amtrak reads as an inaccurate caricature based on my experience.
I asked in passing the frequency with which naysayers in this and other threads ride Amtrak. None of them bothered to answer. I think we know why.

Is it JR? No. But it gets me to and from work 3x/week with much less stress, in less time, and for less money than driving. My biggest complaints, frankly, are usually with the passengers rather than the employees.
  by John_Perkowski
 
lensovet wrote: Tue Sep 24, 2024 11:17 pm
ryanwc wrote: Tue Sep 24, 2024 8:05 pm But Tad's narrative on Amtrak reads as an inaccurate caricature based on my experience.
I asked in passing the frequency with which naysayers in this and other threads ride Amtrak. None of them bothered to answer. I think we know why.
Where I live, I have 4 choices of onward travel destinations a day
— Two to St Louis
— One to Chicago
— One to Los Angeles

Does that get my wife to Tampa to link up with her brother, who is fighting cancer? No.
Does that get me to Hartford or New Haven, CT, where I have friends? No
Does that get me to the Virginia tidewater, where my stepdaughter and grand boys live? No
Does that get me to Dallas, San Antonio, Houston or Omaha, where I have friends? No

In the 1950s and up to the mid 60s, all of these were possible, in comfort, with decent food even in coaches, let alone Pullmans.

Kansas City was once a terminal city, and you could get to many places. You could also get to St Louis, which was as much a gateway city as Chicago or New York.

Amtrak has removed the quality that made the ride in sleeper as good as a nice hotel.

Southwest gets me to the last 30 miles, nationwide.
  by eolesen
 
Uh..... Amtrak was the (poorly thought out and executed) solution to the impact of widespread adoption and accessibility of the automobile to the masses in this country.......

Amtrak doesn't go where most people need to go, unless you happen to live within 100 miles of either the Atlantic or Pacific Coast and want to travel within 100 miles of the same coast.
  by Tadman
 
eolesen wrote: Tue Sep 24, 2024 4:56 pm
John_Perkowski wrote:
eolesen wrote: Mon Sep 16, 2024 7:55 am
When you own the property, you're more likely to take better care of it since you have a vested interest in making money.
Please explain to me the multitude of catenary systems on the NEC and their/their substations state of repair.
Well, that's the norm for a profit driven business. Obviously Amtrak doesn't care about profits.

Sent from my SM-S911U using Tapatalk
This is an important characteristic of government operations. They don't make the same capital acquisition decisions that UP or NS might. Look at British Rail or Canadian National - they ran steam well into the 1960's. Why would they do that when the economic case for diesels was water tight? Because they already ran at a loss, and the higher up front cost of diesels would not change that operating loss to profit. Also perhaps the loss of hundreds of steam-related shop forces is considered a loss in prestige for government administrators.
  by Gilbert B Norman
 
Mr. Dunville, you can also add the DBB (West German varietal of DB; DR was the East) to the latter day steam list.

I recall observing such, on the main line, near Manheim during May '71 (that was after A-Day and when I did do "Eurailpass Marathons").
  by John_Perkowski
 
Gilbert B Norman wrote: Fri Sep 27, 2024 3:43 pm Mr. Dunville, you can also add the DBB (West German varietal of DB; DR was the East) to the latter day steam list.

I recall observing such, on the main line, near Manheim during May '71 (that was after A-Day and when I did do "Eurailpass Marathons").
West Germany generally chose to electrify DB; by the time I arrived in 1983, I could travel Frankfurt/M to Munich to Hamburg to Basel, and beyond, by Inter City trains capable of 200kmph where the track warranted it. Even so, the roundhouses were generally, but not completely retained in service for many years. To this day the BR103 class and the BR120 class passenger electrics are respected for their quality.

The other matter is, even 30 years post reunification, all of Germany is at most a 12 hour rail trip one major terminal to the other. Air doesn’t make nearly as much sense.
  by Tadman
 
eolesen wrote: Sun Sep 29, 2024 3:49 pm Well.... perspective matters. Germany is about the size of Montana, which you can drive across in 9 or 10 hours....
Absolutley. The size of Montana with the population density of New Jersey, and every bordering country is just the same - Holland, Switzerland, France, Austria. The electrification there made sense. High volume, high speed, it adds up.
  by west point
 
Crescent doing fine however 20/20 delayed about 35 minutes at Howell CP in Atlanta by CSX again. Does NS get charged with these delays?? Also 19/20 was delayed at Howell by CSX which makes 19's arrival at Anniston now be at least 28 minutes late. That really caused headaches for NS keeping it on schedule. Somehow CSX needs to be called to task with these delays south of ATL station.
  by Tadman
 
That could be an interlocking that CSX controls, and that raises a good point: Did CSX sign up to give passenger trains priority on the interlockings they control, even if the trains are on someone else's tracks? Amtrak might have some leverage over CSX, but what if it were KCS or G&W that controls the interlocking? They have no contract anywhere with Amtrak and I'd like to see the mechanics of that dispute now.
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