• New York Central Penn Yan Branch

  • Pertaining to all railroading subjects, past and present, in New York State.
Pertaining to all railroading subjects, past and present, in New York State.

Moderator: Otto Vondrak

  by CPSD40-2
 
Where the line comes off the Secondary though - I think there's still a grade there, which is now used for truck access to something down the hill.
  by bwparker1
 
You are correct, although I don't know if it mirrors the original rail grade, it seems to me unlikely, but it could be possible. The remnants of the original switch area are definitely gone....

  by NYC-BKO
 
Thanks for the quick replys, now that I know where everything is I might have figured it out, Brooks on your latest pic, how long has the building been there right under Seneca St.? Remember Larry said they got off the tracks on the connector so there had to be a road to get off on, Central Ave.?.
Look at the lay of the buildings, often they are built around the RR. The curve of Hamilton and if you follow that sans a couple of buildings, it curves right down to Central Ave. and the grade would not have been that steep by the topo map following that route. What date are the maps?

Also if you look at the four buildings, just below Hamilton on Seneca, they are angled, like something came between them.

  by bwparker1
 
Image

Here is a shot of the present day location of the PRR trestle. As you can see, any connection would have had to have started well north of this location.

Looking back at this post:
I located a PRR track map of the area and it shows a connector or spur near PennYan.this track comes off from a block station called BELL north of PennYan.it runs south on the west side of the PRR to some where near the NYC bridge.the map is from 1941 so i don`t know how much help this will be.

I think this is merely a PRR Spur into the PRR Yard. There are way too many houses for any spur to have connected to the NYC from this location. And I think he is referring to he PRR bridge/trestle. Again, the NYC bridge, if it could be called that, is much further off to the west. It was a pole/wooden plank structure to carry the tracks over the outlet.

Again, I have to believe lbagg, as he worked for the NYC but I just don't understand how these to railroads ever physically connected. Maybe some street running?

BWP

  by NYC-BKO
 
Looking at the Topo and Brooks last overhead pic of the area I can see where a track could have come down the way I stated it might have, you have to forget anything you see today, people cover over, build over etc as soon as they know no more trains are coming. Even the Topo has a track shooting off towards Hamilton with the right angle to keep on going around a curve perfect to hit Central at it's end. I'm sorry but I believe this is it.

BTW that pic really doesn't show anything as to why the connector wasn't in that area, sorry.
Last edited by NYC-BKO on Tue Apr 04, 2006 10:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
  by lbagg91833
 
You all have surely worked on this CONUNUNDRUM [sp], and I'm just not qualified re the PRR layout in this area.....except to advise that the NYC handled both inbound & outbound CARLOADS inside the BIRKETT MILLING complex, and the PRR did the same.....although the "CONNECTOR" trackage was BIRKETT MILLING trackage, not PRR per se. How the PRR accessed the MILLING CO. complex is unknown to me. The TRAINMASTER Earl CRANDALL, remarked on our HI-RAIL trip from DRESDEN that PRR/NYC handled interchange via BIRKETT MILLING, and whether OFFICIAL , or not....I'm positive on that score. LARRY BAGGERLY

  by bwparker1
 
NYC-BKO wrote:Looking at the Topo and Brooks last overhead pic of the area I can see where a track could have come down the way I stated it might have, you have to forget anything you see today, people cover over, build over etc as soon as they know no more trains are coming. Even the Topo has a track shooting off towards Hamilton with the right angle to keep on going around a curve perfect to hit Central at it's end. I'm sorry but I believe this is it.

BTW that pic really doesn't show anything as to why the connector wasn't in that area, sorry.
Which Topo are you referring to??

  by NYC-BKO
 
Brooks,
The one from Russ's post on page two.
BTW nice pic of the geep.

Larry,
Do you remember if there was a street were you took the Hi-rail off, inside the complex?

If the PRR had a small yard around the station ( which it looks like they did by the maps ) they surely would have had the connector somewhere near the yard.
I'll stand by my theory until proven wrong otherwise, I'm not trying to start a flame war, just that from what I see this is the most feasible route, unless of course some of those buildings have around for fifty or so years.

  by CPSD40-2
 
I'd love to dig up a photo of this - that would be very cool to try and model!

  by bwparker1
 
Image

Yellow Routes Not Feasible, those buildings were there in the 1960's

Blue Routes: Feasible if you had some great engineering.

There was and is a small yard PRR there.

BWP

  by bwparker1
 
Shots of the yard from 2004:
Image

Image

  by CPSD40-2
 
Thanks for posting those.

More specifically, a photo ( and/or confirmation of the existance of ) the steep grade from the PR to the NYC.

  by NYC-BKO
 
Okay, it's been stated that both railroads served Birketts Mill and that any exchange of cars was done in the mill itself. So there would be no physical connection between the two railroads. What we need to find out is how the PRR got down to the mill not to the NYC line.
  by lbagg91833
 
BRIAN et al: Regarding the location where we set the HI-RAIL car off the track; there was no street there, and the location was just another side track inside the MILLING complex. BEECH CREEK member might just have a STS of the trackage, and I'll query him. Those pictures of MIKE SMITHs' FINGER LAKES RWY look excellent...LARRY BAGGERLY
  by RussNelson
 
I bicycled the Outlet Trail today. Stared hard north of the trail everywhere within town. The only place I could conceive of a connector is inside Birketts Mills, as Larry says. I looked, though, and didn't see any way for the PRR to punch through to Birketts.
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