• New Adirondack Scenic Thread (ADIX)

  • Pertaining to all railroading subjects, past and present, in New York State.
Pertaining to all railroading subjects, past and present, in New York State.

Moderator: Otto Vondrak

  by thebigham
http://www.newyorkupstate.com/outdoors/ ... _plan.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Could ownership issues halt $23 million Adirondack rail, trail plan?
updated October 17, 2016 at 7:30 PM

Recent revelations that the state does not own full title to the entire Remsen-Lake Placid rail corridor raises questions about whether the state's controversial $25 million Adirondack rail, trail plan is still a go, according to opponents of the plan.

State officials, though, remain optimistic.

"As is often the case in projects like this, title questions arise that must be resolved," according a statement from the state Department of Environmental Conservation send to NYup.com today. "DEC and DOT researched the deeds and title to the railroad corridor relating to the acquisition of the corridor by the State in 1974 and determined that four parcels along the corridor are under the ownership of entities other than the State."

One parcel involves about 3,000 feet of feet of land in the village of Saranac Lake where the rail train passes through property owned by North Country Community College, along with two other parcels jointly owned by Essex and Franklin counties, the DEC said. A fourth involves land owned by the Lake Placid/North Elba Historical Society in the village of Lake Placid.

DEC officials, though, insist the ownership issues are minor and will be resolved. Despite a lawsuit, work on the plan is scheduled to begin this spring, DEC Regional Director Robert Stegemann told Adirondack Explorer magazine in a story scheduled to be published in the magazine's November-December issue.

The owners of Adirondack Rail Explorers have already made plans to be at two different locations next spring -- one in Rhode Island, the other in Catskills.

One of the local businesses negatively affected by the plan – Adirondack Rail Explorers – has already made plans to begin operating their unique business at two other locations this spring....
  by ut-1
Kayuta Lake "Trestle Trilogy", yesterday morning, Forestport.
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  by ryanov
I suppose I count as almost a millennial. I rode the train from Utica to Thendara this weekend, after attending an event in Utica. I'd have taken the train to Lake Placid if it were possible. I came up to the area via Amtrak without a car, and I think it's pretty neat, the idea that I might be able to get around, even out in the woods, without a car. I also know that if you pull up rails, you probably don't get them back.

Anyway, I don't know who these folks think they're talking about, but I do know reports say that millennial are eschewing the car culture of previous generations. What another rail trail they can't get to without renting a vehicle does, I don't know. I can't for the life of me figure out why someone would want to rip up tracks that are in active use providing a unique attraction.

Anyways, it was a nice trip, though there was a down tree on the way up and 1508 broke down on the way back.
  by traingeek8223
I was lucky enough to get to chase and ride the North End Operations on the last day, Sunday 10-23-16. Here is a photo album I put together documenting the day:

http://rrpicturearchives.net/archiveThu ... ?id=118995

More to come later
  by Otto Vondrak
The last train from Lake Placid departed on 10/26 to bring the equipment down for winter storage.

http://www.adirondackdailyenterprise.co ... inter.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

  by traingeek8223
A second album of photos taken on the last day of operations, all from the last car of the train on the last run from Saranac Lake to Lake Placid:

http://rrpicturearchives.net/archiveThu ... ?id=119031
  by New Haven 1
Wow Matt. You did a fantastic job of at the very least preserving a record of what it is like to enjoy the journey by rail. I only hope that someone with the power to do so wakes up and realizes the travesty that is about to be committed by this aggressive unheard of before act of deliberately removing an active business that not only generates revenue but is of historic heritage to a region, and replacing it with a permanent taxpayer burden that will allow only those who are physically fit enough to do so to enjoy the vistas that up to now could be enjoyed by essentially everyone. One would have to wonder what an organization like AARP would have to say to the New York government about removing the ability of the vast majority of their members to enjoy this beautiful journey due to the wants of certain well placed financially backed lobbyists.

I am a rail supporter as well as an active bicyclist. I do enjoy riding rail trails where there is no logic of rail use at least in the present. This line couldn't be further from that point.

Unfortunately my financial situation prevented me from being able to come out to support the Adirondack Scenic in this fight.

I can, however, at least share my experience at another much touted about "tourist" draw in New York state. A couple years ago I went to see the well hyped "Walkway over the Hudson" in Poughkeepsie thinking that it would be neat to do just that. The weather being mostly sunny with a temperature of about 78 degrees seemed idyllic. On the day I visited I was with some family members, one of which was elderly and in a wheelchair. I was puzzled at why there were so many empty parking places in the lot of such a well known and published tourist draw. I soon found out why. While the ambient temperature was 78 degrees, the temperature on the structure was quite a bit more. Lo and behold at the entrance to the walkway were warning signs indicating that the reflected heat from all of that concrete in the structure was over 100 degrees. It wisely advised anyone with any type of heat intolerant condition from health to age to not proceed, or, do so at their own risk. As we had went out of our way to see this "wonder", we did venture out to at least take a look. We made it out about 1/3 the way before having to turn around to escape the heat which even for those of us with no health issues was too intense. After making our way back to our vehicles as quickly as possible to escape the heat, we pondered our next move. Since it was not very easy to get to the bridge to begin with, and, we wanted to get this out of the way, we left Poughkeepsie to have a meal back in Kingston where we had ridden the Catskill Mountain Railroad. Total tourist dollars received by Poughkeepsie from us: Zero. Chance that we will go back there: Zero. Total cost to New York taxpayers: Millions and still counting when you consider maintenance, patrols by police etc.

I sincerely hope that New York doesn't turn the Adirondack Scenic into another "Tourist draw/ taxpayer drain" like the walkway.
  by griffs20soccer
I went to our neighbors Halloween party this weekend and got talking to his father. His father is from Saranac Lake. We got talking about the railroad. He said most of the people were for keeping the railroad. He said the town gets thousands of dollars per day form the tourists when the train is running. The people were also not happy to see the jobs that the railbike people brought to the area go away. A friend of his walked the line from Tupper Lake to Lake Placid taking measurements every 1/4 mile, it took him years to complete. His friend said the research he did walking the line showed you could have a bike path beside the railroad the whole way and why can't there be both instead of one and lose the tourist dollars and jobs the area needed. This gentleman is 95 years old and can't understand the reasoning behind the removal of the tracks.
  by greenwichlirr
griffs20soccer wrote:I went to our neighbors Halloween party this weekend and got talking to his father. His father is from Saranac Lake. We got talking about the railroad. He said most of the people were for keeping the railroad.
This is all very true. Just look at the comments on the Adirondack Daily Enterprises Facebook page. Aside from the names of rail advocates (mine included), most, but not all, are in support of keeping the railroad. They all sound rather similar asking the simple logical questions that "that group" likes to try to shoot down: "Why can't the trail be built along side?", "How is a trail going to replace two businesses?", etc. Sure, you get your trail people, both board members of "that group" and non board members, and they all pretty much shoot out venom towards anyone that goes against their vision.

And so it goes....with yet another court delay. It's all getting a little absurd and surreal.
  by Otto Vondrak
The court delays are designed in part to exhaust the war chest. Same thing happened to CMRR and they had to cry "uncle" because the county bled them dry by dragging out the court case.

  by greenwichlirr

Based on what I have been told about the judge who has this case, he's pretty "by the books" (in a good way), and there are people who are thinking (I'm one of them) that these delays are *not* going to help the case if he finally gets tired of it and just decides on it, and the fact that the State has been the ones delaying it all doesn't exactly help their case.

Speculation of course, but it seems plausible.
  by Noel Weaver
I have ridden Utica - Lake Placid in 1980, summer naturally. I have worked and walked the Poughkeepsie Bridge as well. In fact I have worked all three railroads (in the past) at this location. There is a huge difference in the Walkway over the Hudson and the Adirondack Scenic Railroad. The Poughkeepsie Bridge was a basket case in so far as railroading was concerned. The main question was what to do with it and the present solution is a very good one in my opinion. I am sorry that it no longer carries freight between Southern New England and the west and south but the real need for that line went away along with the industries in Connecticut and elsewhere that were the big users of that route. It might have held on a little bit longer had the fire not occurred in May of 1974 but its future was not bright. In this case New York State stepped up to the plate and did a great job preserving this scenic landmark for future generations to enjoy.
It is a shame that the State of New York will not show adequate support to preserve the very scenic rail line between Utica and Lake Place in its entirety for future generations to be able to enjoy as well. If I were still in Upstate New York I might well have gotten involved in this operation and the efforts to preserve the route but here in South Florida there is simply not much that I can do about it, it is what it is but I don't have to like it and I don't like it. New York has lost a fair amount of rail lines that today could have been very valuable for growth and passenger operations. I'll bet if the Harlem to Chatham had not been torn up it would be pretty active today with passenger trains. The New York, Westchester and Boston could have been quite useful in Southern Westchester had it not been torn up when it was. Had New Jersey and New York States not taxed the railroads to death the West Shore might still have been carrying passengers, at least the tracks are still in use but passenger trains on the West Shore are very, very unlikely. There are lots more examples in the area where the tracks are now long gone but they are missed in many respects. The Adirondack Scenic could equal the Grand Canyon Railway in Arizona and maybe even better. You can bet in Europe something like this would never, ever be allowed to happen. What's wrong here?????
Noel Weaver
  by tree68
What's wrong here?????
People with personal agendas and money. The public be d****d....
  by charlie6017
Exactly right, you said it perfectly.

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