Railroad Forums 

  • National Railroads Strike in September?

  • For topics on Class I and II passenger and freight operations more general in nature and not specifically related to a specific railroad with its own forum.
For topics on Class I and II passenger and freight operations more general in nature and not specifically related to a specific railroad with its own forum.

Moderator: Jeff Smith

 #1606217  by eolesen
 
You can resign from the union but still be required to pay Agency Fee which is essentially reduced dues for "representation activities" and losing your voting rights.

The ruling from SCOTUS in Jandus vs. Illinois might be an out for someone working for Metra, MBTA, Amtrak, etc. or any other transit agency which is 100% government funded. I've yet to see it applied. It's been used widely for teachers and other state/county workers to abandon the SEIU and other unions that do more lobbying than representing... But it only applies to government workers and being required to support union sponsored speech as a condition of employment.
 #1606264  by Railjunkie
 
https://www.politico.com/news/2022/09/0 ... s-00055222

https://www.cnbc.com
/2022/09/08/deadline-for-rail-strike-which-could-cost-2-billion-a-day-nears.html

“It has become clear in our post
Presidential Emergency Board (“PEB”) negotiations with the Rail Carriers that they are counting on the Federal Government to come to their aid if we are unable to reach a Tentative Agreement, and so far, we have not reached an Agreement,” BLET President Dennis Pierce and SMART-TD President Jeremy Ferguson stated. ”The same rail carriers that complain about government intervention when the Federal Railroad Administration proposes a rulemaking on crew size, and also shudder at the thought of the Surface Transportation Board issuing regulations that would help shippers, now all but hide behind Congress, refusing so far to negotiate terms our members would accept.

Work rules on the freight side of things really SUCK its bad for us at Amtrak but those at the big class 1s really have it bad. If they do not loosen their policies on sick time days off ect IMHO there will be a strike. If a strike should happen the Fed will order them back to work its happened before it will happen again.
 #1606267  by Gilbert B Norman
 
Mr. Junkie, YOU MUST "go down to the wire"; lest either side be subject to a "you gave in to them".

I'm still holding that rates will be agreed upon at Committee level. Working conditions? Where else but under the rug?

Six DTG - days to go.
 #1606275  by Railjunkie
 
Gilbert B Norman wrote: Fri Sep 09, 2022 11:23 am Mr. Junkie, YOU MUST "go down to the wire"; lest either side be subject to a "you gave in to them".

I'm still holding that rates will be agreed upon at Committee level. Working conditions? Where else but under the rug?

Six DTG - days to go.
Been there done it PEB and all.

However working conditions have never been worse than they are today on the class 1s. Pool jobs were it is next to impossible to get over the road held away for days the inability to get a day off for a needed appointment without suffering some sort of deduction of points is well to put it mildly, stupid. When you have an extra list to cover the job.

To this day we still have no sick days a single personal day the same holds true on the freight side. Do not come to work sick but you can not mark off sick because you we be reprimanded. A single personal day what good is it if you can not use it when you want to or if you have to use it by a certain month.

Railroaders are some of the most studied folks when it comes to sleep because we really do not get any. Granted the passenger side of things can be a little easier than freight, but an extra list is an extra list. It is one of the reasons the federal government changed the HOS rules quite a few years ago. They changed jobs into categories depending on what time of day one went to work or signed off. It also limits how may days you could work in a row and how much rest is needed between starts. Of course this rule is bent or manipulated to fit the carriers needs.

Once again some of this has to change you can keep throwing people out there with little to no rest, knowing they will not be able to make a needed appointment, their vacation has been denied etc. and expect them to preform their assignment to their fullest abilities.
 #1606280  by eolesen
 

Railjunkie wrote:
However working conditions have never been worse than they are today on the class 1s.
Huh.

Ever work a firebox or a coal chute?

Ever have to walk the roof to set brakes?

Ever ride in a caboose without air conditioning or heat?

You guys have it much better today than the railroaders of 50+ years ago...

Sent from my SM-G981U using Tapatalk

 #1606291  by CSRR573
 
Railjunkie wrote: Fri Sep 09, 2022 1:33 pmBeen there done it PEB and all.

However working conditions have never been worse than they are today on the class 1s. Pool jobs were it is next to impossible to get over the road held away for days the inability to get a day off for a needed appointment without suffering some sort of deduction of points is well to put it mildly, stupid. When you have an extra list to cover the job.
Man, you guys in T&E have it much worse then us in Mechancial. No HOS, never denied a vacation day, can accrue book time and paid Holidays
 #1606300  by BandA
 
Unless the unions limit the strike to say one line, of course congress is going to step in, the railroad industry is still important. But it's the most Democrat administration now that they are going to get for quite a while so from the union perspective sooner is better than later.
 #1606308  by Railjunkie
 
eolesen wrote: Fri Sep 09, 2022 2:55 pm
Railjunkie wrote:
However working conditions have never been worse than they are today on the class 1s.
Huh.

Ever work a firebox or a coal chute?

Ever have to walk the roof to set brakes?

Ever ride in a caboose without air conditioning or heat?

You guys have it much better today than the railroaders of 50+ years ago...

Sent from my SM-G981U using Tapatalk
Ever run a drafty GE without heat at 90 plus mph?? I have it ain't fun. Same for the A/C except its the summer you get the added enjoyment of a toilet that smells somewhere between a litter box that has not been cleaned in a couple of weeks and dumpster full of rotting seafood on a 100 degree day. I will take the caboose at 50mph.

Have a camera and microphones directly in your face and by this in mean less than 3 ft for your entire shift watching and listening to your every move for "safety". Never to be used for discipline except in an accident. Well that idea went out the window. I do it every day.

Do your job properly to the fullest of your ability, only to have a buff shoot a little video and it turns up on someones desk and they take exception to a procedure you followed which was not nor is a written rule yet your being brought up on charges? Seen it done, I work with a local chairman and he has shared a few.

Onto my freight brothers and sisters. The rules that current class 1 railroaders work under in regards to attendance policies are draconian at best. I am pretty sure I have posted BNSFs and UPs attendance policies. 50+ years ago you needed a day off you made yourself unavailable for the next day the railroad did not care nor did they asses you point towards discipline. They called an extra man to cover your job. They did not screw with your vacation time because they were short help.

Officials were not out to see how many pelts they could hang on their wall. If they were, generally they were spoken to. Unlike today were it seems its part of the training they receive. You can not be going to work looking over your shoulder wondering what am I going to get fired for today. You cant work safely like that around large heavy equipment that can kill you in a second.

The railroad may have been a more dangerous place 50+ plus years ago because of the type of job but people still die out here today. May not be from walking a roof to set a hand brake, could it be from the constant stress they are under to get trains over the road with lack of sleep? Not having some down time with family ? Perhaps it could be lack proper training as some railroads have shortened their training classes from 8 to 6 weeks so they can get boots on the ground. Then rush them through promotion classes and suddenly you have a newly minted conductor who may not be ready for such an assignment. They could end up getting themselves or someone else in a jam or worse, because the way it works for discipline is you did it, he knew about it. Your both fired/banned for a minimum of 30 days if your lucky, most common Ive seen is 90 days.

That is no pay kids

I would also suggest you go on YouTube and follow some folks who are no longer railroad employees, they are not there with an axe to grind but give tips and some in site on what to expect if you were to hire out. Trust me some of us could use it.

Lastly if this job is so great and the railroads treat their employees so well then why are so many with 20+ years of service quitting to find another line of work??? That's a lot of money and benefits to be leaving on the table for you and your significant other.
 #1606309  by Railjunkie
 
CSRR573 wrote: Fri Sep 09, 2022 4:40 pm Man, you guys in T&E have it much worse then us in Mechancial. No HOS, never denied a vacation day, can accrue book time and paid Holidays
Amtrak really doesn't screw with us much on vacations and such we do get paid holidays. The point I was making is about how the freight guys are treated like slaves. HOS was better back in the day 8 hours off unless you worked 12 then it was 10. Work how many days in a row as you wanted to. Cant do it any more with the new rules. We don't accrue nothing no sick days and a single personal day which we have to use by Oct 17th or something like that.
 #1606310  by John_Perkowski
 
Embargoes are beginning…

Railroads begin embargoes on hazardous materials in preparation for possible work stoppage
By David Lassen | September 9, 2022


Brief, fair use quotes…
NS says agreements have been reached or are being finalized with 10 of 12 unions, warns other service disruptions could begin as soon as Tuesday; UP, AAR also address shutdown planning

Ed Elkins, executive vice president and chief marketing officer at Norfolk Southern, wrote in a Friday message to intermodal customers that railroads “have reached or are finalizing tentative agreements with 10 of the 12 unions involved in negotiations.” To date, five unions have announced tentative agreements [see “Two more unions reach tentative agreements …,” Trains News Wire, Sept. 3, 2022].

“We asked the two holdout unions for a commitment not to strike so we could continue normal operations,” Elkins wrote, “but they have declined.”

That being the case, Elkins said, NS will begin embargoing certain types of shipments as of today, “which includes rail security-sensitive material and certain time-sensitive shipments outlined in the embargo.” Other customers, including bulk unit trains, intermodal, and automotive, will see a curtailment of service up to 72 hours before the end of the cooling-off period “to prepare for a safe and orderly stoppage should there be a strike.”
 #1606311  by JayBee
 
The Unions tried to strike just one railroad, twenty some years ago, The companies response was for all the railroads to lockout everybody, so a selective strike won't work.
 #1606316  by STrRedWolf
 
A question for all those out on the roads. I've heard a ton about BNSF's attendance policy, and for an outsider holding a blue-collar 9-5 job, it stinks to hell and back. "16 tons, what do you get?" basically.

My question is, what is UP's attendance policy? NS? CSX? CN? I'd like some details to see if they're all equally bad, or they're just in the range of "garbage."
 #1606327  by Railjunkie
 
STrRedWolf wrote: Sat Sep 10, 2022 8:14 am A question for all those out on the roads. I've heard a ton about BNSF's attendance policy, and for an outsider holding a blue-collar 9-5 job, it stinks to hell and back. "16 tons, what do you get?" basically.

My question is, what is UP's attendance policy? NS? CSX? CN? I'd like some details to see if they're all equally bad, or they're just in the range of "garbage."
https://www.railwayage.com/freight/clas ... ce-policy/

https://ble-t.com/resc/pdf_tey_attendance_072821.pdf (Union Pacific)

http://smartlocal1162.org/wp-content/up ... -Final.pdf (this was put out as Q&A by a local but it covers CSX policy)

These are a few I have been able to find basically you are given a number of points you loose them faster than you can make them back and the railroad decides how many you loose.

In some cases it may even apply to your drive into work. BNSF is by far the least palatable the only railroad I couldn't find with a policy was the Norfolk Southern BUT they have other point systems they use in the course of their daily ops.
 #1606335  by CharlieL
 
This all sounds to me like what's happening in other industries: middle and upper management didn't grow up in the business, instead have MBAs. Case in point, Boeing. HQ moved away from engineering and shop floor (Seattle to Chicago), things turn to --- not good.
 #1606338  by eolesen
 
The UP policy isn't unlike what I've seen for flight attendants or other non-fixed schedule jobs.

Bottom line is that you're not working in retail or a warehouse. You're in a time critical job where your absences have a huge ripple effect on others.

Average comp goes from 95K to 110K plus benefits of 40-50K in value.

That ain't chump change. Good money has a cost. Quit your pissing & moaning about being expected to show up to work already and cash the checks.

If you want the ability to miss work with no real impact or consequences, I'm sure Amazon has a warehouse job open somewhere near you.

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