Mixed Trains in North America

Keewatin (and TTI, for that matter) are both unique because they're owned by first nations governments. Both are pretty cool little operations, esp. TTI

ConstanceR46 wrote: ↑Fri Mar 06, 2020 9:01 pm Keewatin (and TTI, for that matter) are both unique because they're owned by first nations governments. Both are pretty cool little operations, esp. TTI

Remind me which one TTI is - the one in British Columbia?

I feel like there are some mixed operations in South America that I’m missing. Paging Tad!

The Warrington-era Kentucky Cardinal and "Heifer Zephyr" were mixed trains that came about, not by adding a passenger coach to a freight train, but by tacking express freight on to a passenger train. The idea, at first glance, anyway, has merit; you can travel by rail from New York to Los Angeles in three days, but a freight shipment can't do it in less than five, or so I've read. But Warrington tried to do it without consulting the host railroads, and it seems to me that no such plan would work unless they shared in the profit. So the question is, if CSX has to host Amtrak trains, why not use them to haul UPS or Fedex shipments or other time-sensitive freight, and thereby earn back some of what it costs to run the trains?

IIRC, some of the last true "mixed" trains ran in Georgia until the late 1970's-early 1980's with typically one coach on the rear of a freight train. Trains magazine did an article on them in the 1980's right around the time they were withdrawn.

shit - i meant TRT, Tshiuetin Rail Transportation, which is in Labrador.

Newfoundland Railway (later CN) ran a mixed train daily from St. John's to Argentia. I rode on it in the late '50s. Long gone, unfortunately.

charlesriverbranch wrote: ↑Sat Mar 07, 2020 11:41 am The Warrington-era Kentucky Cardinal and "Heifer Zephyr" were mixed trains that came about, not by adding a passenger coach to a freight train, but by tacking express freight on to a passenger train. The idea, at first glance, anyway, has merit; you can travel by rail from New York to Los Angeles in three days, but a freight shipment can't do it in less than five, or so I've read. But Warrington tried to do it without consulting the host railroads, and it seems to me that no such plan would work unless they shared in the profit. So the question is, if CSX has to host Amtrak trains, why not use them to haul UPS or Fedex shipments or other time-sensitive freight, and thereby earn back some of what it costs to run the trains?

Amazon Amtrak partnership, anyone?

scratchyX wrote: ↑Mon Mar 09, 2020 11:04 am Amazon Amtrak partnership, anyone?

The concept keeps coming up, and it keeps coming back to “Amazon can’t depend on Amtrak’s timeliness, even on the Corridor.” Amtrak and VIA could do a better palletized or ULD-packed express service though, in conjunction with each country’s postal service so as to comply with the letter (heh) of their respective host road agreements. Keeping in mind though, many of the largest USPS facilities are at airports or off major highways, no longer on railroads especially at train stations.

scratchyX wrote: ↑Mon Mar 09, 2020 11:04 am

charlesriverbranch wrote: ↑Sat Mar 07, 2020 11:41 am The Warrington-era Kentucky Cardinal and "Heifer Zephyr" were mixed trains that came about, not by adding a passenger coach to a freight train, but by tacking express freight on to a passenger train. The idea, at first glance, anyway, has merit; you can travel by rail from New York to Los Angeles in three days, but a freight shipment can't do it in less than five, or so I've read. But Warrington tried to do it without consulting the host railroads, and it seems to me that no such plan would work unless they shared in the profit. So the question is, if CSX has to host Amtrak trains, why not use them to haul UPS or Fedex shipments or other time-sensitive freight, and thereby earn back some of what it costs to run the trains?

Amazon Amtrak partnership, anyone?

Amazon runs passenger and freight rail service, possibly? (If at all? The freight service would have to be done in a baggage car or two, or a designated mail car I guess.)

To ask, is TRT connected to the North American national network or an isolated operation?

mtuandrew wrote: ↑Mon Mar 09, 2020 12:12 pm” Amtrak and VIA could do a better palletized or ULD-packed express service though, in conjunction with each country’s postal service so as to comply with the letter (heh) of their respective host road agreements. Keeping in mind though, many of the largest USPS facilities are at airports or off major highways, no longer on railroads especially at train stations.

The SPG USPS terminal was the reason why trains 12/412 and 13 worked. It was a central hub for New England.

There are still disused platforms at Farley. The Washington, DC main post office at Union Station (which had a rail spur) is now the U.S. National Postal Museum, though USPS still has a retail station inside. St. Louis and Pittsburgh also have their post offices next to their rail stations, but the PHL-30 Street post office has been downsized.

mtuandrew wrote: ↑Mon Mar 09, 2020 12:12 pm Keeping in mind though, many of the largest USPS facilities are at airports or off major highways, no longer on railroads especially at train stations.

Portland, Oregon's main post office used to be right next door to Union Station. But civic leaders looking at 13 acres of prime real estate decided that it would be better to demolish the post office, move it 10 miles away out to the airport on an abandoned golf course, and then replace it with lots of expensive, above market condos, AirBnBs, a token amount of "affordable" housing for the poor, some parks, and more brewpubs and wine cellars.

wigwagfan: I mean, I can understand not wanting to waste the real estate downtown, when most of the mail is delivered by motor truck rather than by horse & carriage. Ramsey County, MN purchased the concourse of St. Paul Union Depot which had been the local US Postal Service distribution center; their new distro center is in the southern suburbs. Easier to transload pallet-sized bins or ULDs off trains to trucks to the off-rail distro centers - in the Twin Cities it would be somewhere around the old Amtrak station, for instance.

mtuandrew wrote: ↑Mon Mar 09, 2020 12:12 pm

scratchyX wrote: ↑Mon Mar 09, 2020 11:04 am Amazon Amtrak partnership, anyone?

The concept keeps coming up, and it keeps coming back to “Amazon can’t depend on Amtrak’s timeliness, even on the Corridor.” Amtrak and VIA could do a better palletized or ULD-packed express service though, in conjunction with each country’s postal service so as to comply with the letter (heh) of their respective host road agreements. Keeping in mind though, many of the largest USPS facilities are at airports or off major highways, no longer on railroads especially at train stations.

Yeah, can't imagine "Get it Wednesday (or maybe Thursday?)" would work in the delivery options.

Since Amazon is now operating its own airplanes and has distribution centers close to airports, I really can't imagine they'd mess with another third party who arrives and departs from downtown terminals and stations....

Pensyfan19 wrote: ↑Wed Mar 04, 2020 7:51 pm What about restoring the Newfoundland Railway and the Prince Edward Island railway and maybe a few lines in remote parts of North America which need rail service such as parts of Nova Scotia, parts of the Midwest (KS, OK, ND, MN, MT) and even in some parts of the south (WV, GA, SC, NC, TN).

SC is car country. Lots of roads and little traffic.

Pensyfan19 wrote: ↑Wed Mar 04, 2020 7:51 pm What about restoring the Newfoundland Railway and the Prince Edward Island railway...…...

There's really no wilderness areas on PEI where you would be miles from the nearest road. And looking at this aerial photo.....flying over the island is like a patchwork of fields.

https://goo.gl/maps/LkgHpBpqUVhMNAtW9

The only reason to restore a 'Mixed Train' would be as a tourist attraction on a short portion of the nearly 450 km of former CN right-of-way that's been preserved across the island as the 'Confederation Trail' for hiking and biking.

https://www.tourismpei.com/pei-confederation-trail

Here's a portion of the tail in Montague where the old station is the town's Tourist Centre and Marina Office:













And the old stone station at Kensington: