Michigan Central Station

The problem is that Michigan Central station is not on Amtrak's current Chicago-Pontiac route. Using the MC station would require a probably lengthy backup move or the elimination of service north of Detroit. Neither one seems a good option at the moment.

CHTT1 wrote:The problem is that Michigan Central station is not on Amtrak's current Chicago-Pontiac route. Using the MC station would require a probably lengthy backup move or the elimination of service north of Detroit. Neither one seems a good option at the moment.

Not THAT long of a backing move. Actually, no backing move at all - it would just be reversing direction with the engineer changing ends to the cab car or second locomotive. It slipped my mind that the Wolverines operate with F40 cabbages and will operate with Siemens Viaggio Brightline cab cars once they’re delivered. Only somewhat obnoxious, not a big pain with a conductor hanging off a Horizon with a brake hose in 10 degree weather and horizontal sleet.

New Center is a good station location and I hope it remains Amtrak’s main stop, at least until light rail reaches MCS at an indeterminate time in the future. Kind of like how Atlanta Peachtree is inadequate, but better than any other location save downtown. In the future, I’d like it to fulfill a North Philadelphia or Washington L’Enfant role for commuter rail too.

east point wrote:Once the plans are finalized enough and work can begin the question will be how soon could passenger service return to the station ? Then of course getting Amtrak to move would take more time ?

It will move at the speed of money ... That being said don't be surprised if big things happen. Agencies that would not otherwise be involved will try to support Ford to the furthest extent possible. This is a very special and unusual situation and the Ford name has a lot of pull.

There have already been very clear indications that there will be major tax credits in play at every level. I would also expect matching funds for highway improvements to materialize. Passenger rail is not a major leap of the imagination after that.

In terms of years I would say no sooner than 5 and that's if they made an announcement regarding service tomorrow. They need at least three to do the renovation.

One hopes that in this still-mythical station, Ford leaves a little room for US CBP.h

I've thought about the international possibilities as well ... That is one major benefit of keeping four tracks ... It's much easier to build an international arrival and departure facility.

mtuandrew wrote: Not THAT long of a backing move. Actually, no backing move at all - it would just be reversing direction with the engineer changing ends to the cab car or second locomotive. It slipped my mind that the Wolverines operate with F40 cabbages and will operate with Siemens Viaggio Brightline cab cars once they’re delivered. Only somewhat obnoxious, not a big pain with a conductor hanging off a Horizon with a brake hose in 10 degree weather and horizontal sleet.

No, they don’t, and no, they won’t.

The cabbages were removed from AML service because of the 110 speed limit. A few of the Wolverines use only one P42 because there is only a limited number with ITCS, most of them captive in Michigan Service.

Also, IDOT didn’t order any cab cars. That was California only.

This station will not likely be reactivated for Amtrak service, in fact Ford is not in the train business.

Ford has extensive facilities in Detroit nearby which are also by the tracks and this is like a satellite campus for them.

They could use the trains for hauling materials or as a shuttle back to their other facilities so rail usage as freight or potential employee shuttles could make sense, but Amtrak passenger service to a firm like Ford likely doesn’t.

The facility needs a makeover and cleaning up of the grounds which obviously Ford will do. I don’t know if all the station tracks will survive or if they will reconfigure or remove them or whatnot.

Fortunately the old unused stations with significant architectural features like Buffalo Central and now Michigan Central are all going through restoration which is a good thing even if they won’t be reused for Passenger services. These stations should be landmarked and preserved.

Ford could allow for tours or public usage of parts of the building.

adamj023 wrote:
The facility needs a makeover and cleaning up of the grounds which obviously Ford will do. I don’t know if all the station
tracks will survive or if they will reconfigure or remove them or whatnot....

The CEO of Ford Land, who is in charge of the makeover, stated that four of the passenger tracks will be kept intact, specifically for bringing passenger rail back to the terminal again.


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Even if Ford is willing to allow passenger rail, the question is if it is possible based on the rail system as it is today as much has changed.

I am not against reutilization of old terminals but one must think of existing traffic, high speed rail and a lot of complexities to see if remaking the stations is feasible.

History Channel just aired Detroit, Comeback City. It has lots of shots of MC Station from constructions photos right up the Ford's purchase just about a month ago. The station is the backdrop for personal stories, historical accounts, and other comments. There are both photos and film. There's a shot of the Mercury equipment leaving MC station behind Hudson #5344. Also film of a PC 3 car train leaving. Interiors/exteriors then and now. Also plenty of street and neighborhood scenes. Fairly accurate, slight blurring of historical periods, but way better than some PBS programs. MC Station probably figures in about 40 minutes of the one hour program. My Guide says this was the first showing of DETROIT, COMEBACK CITY.

Detroit, MI used to be a thriving middle class community built up by the automakers and other industry. Today it has a multitude of problems even if a few jobs are coming back.

If I worked in Detroit, I sure wouldn’t want to live there today. At least with Amtrak you can take a train ride to commute elsewhere.

Its a shame that many US cities and towns have fallen behind.

WesternNation wrote:No, they don’t, and no, they won’t.

The cabbages were removed from AML service because of the 110 speed limit. A few of the Wolverines use only one P42 because there is only a limited number with ITCS, most of them captive in Michigan Service.

Also, IDOT didn’t order any cab cars. That was California only.

Oh. It’s been a hot minute since I’ve ridden the Wolverine so hadn’t seen the new operational patterns, and I’d forgotten that the F40 whether locomotive or cab is limited to 100. Guess it would have to be a backing move after all, or that north-of-Detroit would have to be a separate service.

It occurs to me that it could be very reasonable for Detroit to have two Amtrak stations. There are plenty of other places with a main terminal and a secondary station. The routing is inefficient but I wonder how many passengers ride through Detroit.

Lest we forget, King Henry was briefly in the railroad business, but he decided that he was King and not some "reggerlaters out in Washington."

From Wiki:

The DT&I went bankrupt in 1908, but remained solvent until it was purchased by Henry Ford in 1920. Ford recognized the strategic importance of the line to his automobile business; the line connected Dearborn, Michigan, to all of the major east-west rail lines in the Midwest. This gave Ford direct control over shipments of raw materials and finished goods to and from his factories in Dearborn. The line thrived and saw numerous improvements under Ford's management. But Ford sold the line in 1929 to the Pennsylvania Railroad after becoming disgusted with interference and over regulation from the Interstate Commerce Commission.

I'm not certain if the DT&I ever operated passenger trains. If they did, it was "Many Moons ago".

Short answer: Yes. Until ca. 1931 but very limited.

I am curious about the reference to "West End Ave" in the timetable as that appears to be a different station from MCS. Also saw a reference to "Detroit Union Station" in other material which I believe is MCS.

Interesting that we can now say definitively that Ford Motor Co. was at one time "in the business" as a passenger rail service operator through its ownership of the DT&I.