• LIRR Mainline Third Track Project

  • Discussion of the past and present operations of the Long Island Rail Road.
Discussion of the past and present operations of the Long Island Rail Road.

Moderator: Liquidcamphor

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  by workextra
 
Regardless, there is other information conveyed by the aspect of fixed signals.
RAS is basically absolute main track switch targets
That can display Stop and go, and if the switch is less than 30 mph, “go slow” (RGW) all lit!
It’s. Really foolish. I don’t see any benefits.

With modern LED low power consumption capabilities of going solar, wayside fIxed ABS plus the CSS.
Would allow LIRR full operational redundancy.
Speed failures can still
Run MAS 59mph by block signal indication.
They’re thinking too far into simple
Stuff.
Degrees, not experienced railroad men calling the shots
  by Head-end View
 
Yeah......I was gonna ask, aren't the people who design these things, professional signal engineers who should know their business?

Also, even with these RAS installations, doesn't the engineer still have speed signals in the cab to give more info than the wayside signal?

Workextra, in the case you cited of a Slow Proceed, with all three lights lit, why do they even need that aspect instead of the regular Proceed Cab? Won't the cab signal show a 15 or 20 code, something like that?
  by photobug56
 
workextra wrote: Sun Sep 12, 2021 11:47 pm Indeed! They were a very poor design by people who don’t operate trains.
And red historically was always on the bottom of the head, never on the top.
This was done or so I read, to prevent the red bulb from being obscured by snow build up on the lens hood below it.

This is just a foolish signal system. Frankly I’m not sure what the benefits of this system is compared to traditional speed signaling?
They give absolutely No information to the engineer.
Can someone in the know educated me on what the benefits of The RAS is?

As for Garden City, 1) LIRR needs to just use eminent domain an finish the project, the town can bitch and moan,
And then if they continue to complain.
Why not simply discontinue service to all garden city stations, the same as some
Roads did a century ago elsewhere. The neighbors Tune will change quickly.
:-D (don’t get all bent out of shape guys)

That said, there is a peaceful mediation. And it’s it in the way of the now abandoned wading-river extension.
Take the bridge stones and footings form there, relocate it to Denton avenue, and duplicate the existing span, but 3 tracks wide, get creative and maybe bring the arch top back (if this one had it) in the 1840s.
Is any of what Garden City is suing on needed to get the mainline up to 3 tracks to Hicksville?
  by Head-end View
 
Yes, I believe the LIRR can't build a third track over that bridge until they get the legal issues worked out so the bridge can be widened to accommodate that extra track.

But as per the Newsday article Garden City is asking the MTA for $10 Million in concessions re: the tall steel poles, etc. As I said in a previous post, I think this whole lawsuit is just an attempt to extort a huge monetary settlement out of the MTA. Money talks, period.
  by photobug56
 
So this bridge is on the mainline.. In which case this sounds like extortion, at the expense LIRR ticket buyers and state taxpayers, all to be poured into one of the richest whitest communities on Long Island.
  by workextra
 
It’s a criminal move by GC, they’re playing politics. LIRR should use their eminent domain, finish the project and tie GC up in court for years and years,
They could even. Complete the project through Nassau interlocking, and then bypassing NHP, MAV eastbound (no EB service to those stations.
This will force GC’s Concession, because NHP will blow a gasket.
That’s how you play politics.
  by Andrewmad
 
I cannot believe how narrow the roadway is. The pedestrian overpass is still not ready. Very poor planning with this one.
  by NRGeep
 
photobug56 wrote: Tue Sep 14, 2021 6:53 pm So this bridge is on the mainline.. In which case this sounds like extortion, at the expense LIRR ticket buyers and state taxpayers, all to be poured into one of the richest whitest communities on Long Island.
Sounds similar to the "old money" town of Hingham Ma and their extortion of the MBTA in the 90's to construct a tunnel under their downtown when the ex NH South Shore lines were rebuilt after decades of dormancy.
  by photobug56
 
If there was the room, I'd tell them to completely bypass Garden City and close any stations cut off by the bypass.
  by workextra
 
P’bug,
There is that option, simply
Don’t stop at MAV.
Locally the residents have plenty of other travel options available to them.
The railroad can remove the new pre fab station and use it elsewhere where the people would better appreciate it.
Plow the 3rd track through, and for added insult to injury, make Denton a 2 lane wide 4 track bridge With modern abutments and all, even light up clearance signs with a truck “can opener” for disobedient drivers!!
Going on with the theme, They should make the north fright track a double ended siding as Far East as they can go.
Continue their beautiful cast concrete wall around the site of the now former Station. Best of all no more noise complaints about station platform announcements.

Realistically speaking it’s no loss,
These folks have both Mineola, And NHP next door, Both would absolutely love ticketing the nuisance cars from GC residents. Additionally GC Still would have the use of 4 other stations in The community.
Sometimes the game has to be played. Unfortunately it won’t.
But it would truthfully be funny and worth the additional fare to see Garden City wrecked by THEIR OWN NIMBY BULL *!

Disclaimer: the above comment was intended to add some Humor to laugh at because it will ruffle some feathers :-D
No harm, No foul, Just fun.



PS. IMO, Garden City was more foolish by either not allowing or not fighting LIRR to make Nassau Blvd bridge double wide to allow for save traffic flow with no merge. This was the bigger battle To fight.
  by photobug56
 
What effect in real life do all of you think that this project will have on LIRR? We know the official reasons, but how well do you think it will work out? Yes, if one track is out (without affecting the others), it will help maintain service. But beyond that and what we might get if and when ESA ever opens?
  by Patch Hog
 
Allows for both express trains and reverse peak service. Service planning is currently hamstrung by those competing priorities and only 2 tracks.
  by Head-end View
 
Photobug, notwithstanding your usual pessimism about the LIRR, ESA will open. It's just a matter of time. Way too much money has been spent for it not to happen now.
  by photobug56
 
Patch Hog wrote: Fri Sep 17, 2021 11:21 am Allows for both express trains and reverse peak service. Service planning is currently hamstrung by those competing priorities and only 2 tracks.
It allows. Of course. But the question is - what do you think they will actually do? And yes, I'm a skeptic. I remember, for instance, NYCTA in Manhattan for many years resisting 'Limited' stop bus service on certain routes. For decades. Then ONE person retired and his replacement finally started doing them. In regards to LIRR, I once compared a number of routes and schedules to ones from the late 1800's. They were nearly identical, even though it was steam versus M's and diesels. A century had passed and schedules had barely changed.

Stony Brook U, for instance, could use reverse peak service. In the evening, there are very few west bound PJ trains, hours apart. Too bad to be blamed on single tracking.
  by photobug56
 
Head-end View wrote: Fri Sep 17, 2021 6:51 pm Photobug, notwithstanding your usual pessimism about the LIRR, ESA will open. It's just a matter of time. Way too much money has been spent for it not to happen now.
You are quite correct about 'too much money'. But it disturbs me that the closer we get to Dec 2022, the less we hear about the work. In contrast, London's TFL puts out frequent updates regarding the Elizabeth Line, shows train testing videos, stations completed and being turned over - you've got a good feel for the progress and sometimes problems.

With ESA, we get hardly any of that. We've heard that the escalators were built by companies with a lousy track record. We've heard little about the elevators. Nothing about what happens if there's a blackout. Etc. Now ESA and 3rd track project are linked, both are critical to LIRR. With 3rd track I get updates non-stop. Not with ESA. So while I may be skeptical about LIRR taking full advantage of 3rd track, I can have confidence that most of that project is rapidly progressing (except Garden City). I've no such confidence about ESA given the secrecy.
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