Kenya- Uganda Railway

philipmartin wrote:

johnthefireman wrote: Kenya Standard Gauge

I thought the railway tender report had something to do with steam locomotives; but I see not.
3500 new workers; 3.6 billion Kenyan shillings to put in the SG: welcome to the high tax club, John.
I'm glad to see that the US isn't the only country with political turmoil. Right now we here have a president who is making laws all by himself. Something new; just what we need.
Reading about the Mandera massacres and the Chinese cyber criminals in your Daily Nation.

In the real world, there is no future for steam as a real means of transport - or any other base of energy.

I ask the moderator to delete the above three sentences since they violate Mr. Perkowski's policy.

Moderators note: Done.I think you can relax a bit more in the worldwide forum,Philip, as we do tend to drift a bit more than is possible in the other forums. We have only a few regular contributors who know each other pretty well, and its unlikely to erupt into a flame war in here.
Having said that , We should try to honor Mr Perkowski's request, especially in regard to USA politics. I think Discussion of politics in other countries is generally ok in here , as we need to know the background regarding the countries and cultures the railway operates in . We are here to learn, enjoy and discuss worldwide railways and the countries they are in , just keep it civil and there will be no need to moderate anything. Thanks David.

Thank you, David. I used a little bad judgement which you corrected for me.

george matthews wrote:In the real world, there is no future for steam as a real means of transport - or any other base of energy.

Not strictly true, although I suspect you are referring to steam produced by carbon-based fuels such as coal and oil. In Kenya an increasing amount of electricity is being produced by natural geothermal steam from deep underground. And I think I'm right in saying that nuclear energy is used to produce steam to drive turbines to generate electricity, although perhaps you are also opposed to nuclear power.

David, thanks for using a light touch to moderate this forum. It is much appreciated. I agree with you that we don't seem to be susceptible to flame wars with the current regular posters, and that some political discussion often provides useful context to a discussion of railways in different parts of the world.

johnthefireman wrote:

george matthews wrote:In the real world, there is no future for steam as a real means of transport - or any other base of energy.

Not strictly true, although I suspect you are referring to steam produced by carbon-based fuels such as coal and oil. In Kenya an increasing amount of electricity is being produced by natural geothermal steam from deep underground. And I think I'm right in saying that nuclear energy is used to produce steam to drive turbines to generate electricity, although perhaps you are also opposed to nuclear power.

Yes, of course I mean the burning of coal, oil and gas to make steam. But locomotive steam is not going to be produced by geothermal, except as electricity.

I had no idea that geo thermal steam was being used anywhere. Isn't that great.

Thanks, George. I was responding primarily to your phrase "or any other base of energy", not necessarily transport. But as you say, electricity is used for railway transport. There is some talk of electrifying the standard gauge line in Kenya, and ironically that electricity might well be largely produced by steam, of the geothermal variety.

philipmartin wrote:I had no idea that geo thermal steam was being used anywhere. Isn't that great.

The electrified Italian railways got their power from geothermal steam, probably as far back as the 1930s. Italy is well supplied by geothermal - at least near Naples.

george matthews wrote:
The electrified Italian railways got their power from geothermal steam, probably as far back as the 1930s. Italy is well supplied by geothermal - at least near Naples.

To be funny, they have Vesuvius right there. I can't imagine the technology used to harness geothermal energy, and back in the 30s, when cars had running boards.

philipmartin wrote:

george matthews wrote:
The electrified Italian railways got their power from geothermal steam, probably as far back as the 1930s. Italy is well supplied by geothermal - at least near Naples.

To be funny, they have Vesuvius right there. I can't imagine the technology used to harness geothermal energy, and back in the 30s, when cars had running boards.

You don't have to imagine it. Just read the history and the technical description. Italy gets a large part of its electricity from geothermal.

philipmartin wrote:I can't imagine the technology used to harness geothermal energy

At its simplest you just drill a hole in the ground and use the steam to drive a turbine.

I've been unaware of it.

Unless you live in a country where it is common, geothermal power is probably not common knowledge.
Heres a link to New zealand's oldest station.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wairakei_Power_Station" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

David Benton wrote:Unless you live in a country where it is common, geothermal power is probably not common knowledge.
Heres a link to New zealand's oldest station.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wairakei_Power_Station" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

It is at least 30 years since I heard of the possibilities of geological steam power in Kenya from surveys of the potential. I haven't been following the developments there but I think Kenya's potential may be not unlike New Zealand's. There are small energy converters in the Rift, in the north of Kenya. The same ought to be the case in Tanzania and further north, in parts of Ethiopia. The tectonic movements of the Rift Valley have great possibilities. There is another Rift Valley roughly along the border between Uganda and Congo. This area too ought to be assessed.

Geological power is a source of energy that doesn't affect the climate (because it doesn't increase the proportion of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere) and ought to be developed wherever the potential exists.

If the SG railway being built is powered by electricity from these sources it would be a small contribution to countering the catastrophe from burning oil and coal.

(On Tuesday I travelled up to London by electric train - third rail - at about 100 mph. And also on the Underground.)