FL9AC rebuilds and disposition

Discussion relating to the operations of MTA MetroNorth Railroad including west of Hudson operations and discussion of CtDOT sponsored rail operations such as Shore Line East and the Springfield to New Haven Hartford Line

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Penn Central
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Re: FL9 AC Info

Post by Penn Central » Fri Jan 23, 2009 7:39 pm

MN-P32AC-DM-201-227 wrote:Whats the advantage to having AC traction motors, as a pose to DC Traction motors? More pulling power, or higher voltage?


Most DC traction motors have internal components that need maintenance (brushes, commutator, etc.). AC traction motors are sealed and do not have those parts. To put it simply, an AC traction motor is composed of two elctro-magnets that create an opposing force that is used to turn the motor. There are brushless DC motors, but that is a different topic. Because of their simplicity, AC traction motor are believed to be much more reliable than DC motors. With DC traction motors, if an engineer leaves the throttle out while the engine is stopped, the motor can be damaged by arcing. With an AC traction motor, like those on M-N Genesis engines, that is not an issue.

Here's the first FL9-AC, which was affectionately called the Starship Enterprise.

Image

DutchRailnut
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Re: FL9 AC Info

Post by DutchRailnut » Fri Jan 23, 2009 9:37 pm

To put it simple on a DC motor the high current component is the rotating part of motor so high current has to be fed through Carbon Brushes via commutator.
On AC motor there are two small slip rings to feed the rotating magents in Rotor. the high power components are actually the stator or non moving part.
The slip ring brushes require very litlle maintenance and last for long time, the AC motor can sustain high current while stopped or running at high speed making it much more universal for any operating speed.
If Conductors are in charge, why are they promoted to be Engineer???

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Maybrook fan
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Re: FL9 AC Info

Post by Maybrook fan » Sat Jan 24, 2009 2:44 am

As stated earlier the advantage of AC is less maintinance and more power. When they did run I remember seeing 1 engine on the upper Harlem with 6 or 7 cars headed for GCT. Where as the DC units were always doubled up on a train that size.

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Re: FL9 AC Info

Post by DutchRailnut » Sat Jan 24, 2009 5:29 pm

cause a FL9ac is 3000 HP and a FL-9 is only 1750 hp
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Alcochaser
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Re: FL9 AC Info

Post by Alcochaser » Sun Jan 25, 2009 2:10 am

Otto Vondrak wrote:
MN-P32AC-DM-201-227 wrote:Are they all scraped now? I remember seeing a photo of one being cut up.


Yes, the scrap metal scraped across the ground when they were all scrapped. ;-)

-otto-


You may even find the 3200HP 710G-12 prime movers in a Tug, Ferry, or other boat in the Hudson river..... how is that for irony!

Old locomotive engines are favorites for companies to re power boats with!

FL9AC
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Re: FL9 AC Info

Post by FL9AC » Sun Jan 25, 2009 6:56 pm

Otto Vondrak wrote:
FL9AC's were garbage.

-otto-

I don't think we should talking like thought about one of our members. FL9AC.


HAHAHA thanks! I too feel as if at least one of these extremely rare and unique locomotives (although not extremely reliable) should have been saved...at least to represent one of the first real attempts at AC propulsion in the U.S. Quite a beefy looking (and sounding) locomotive :wink: .

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Tadman
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Re: FL9 AC Info

Post by Tadman » Sun Jan 25, 2009 8:50 pm

I might be wrong, but I think EMD still has the F69PHAC sitting around somewhere. That was a early-adopter AC locomotive too. Also, does BNSF still have their SD60-AC's too?

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Re: FL9 AC Info

Post by DutchRailnut » Sun Jan 25, 2009 8:57 pm

The two F69PHIAC's are at NRE in very sorry state, the Amtrak F40PHAC 222 is at Pueblo test track.

Image

Image
If Conductors are in charge, why are they promoted to be Engineer???

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MN-P32AC-DM-201-227
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Re: FL9AC rebuilds and disposition

Post by MN-P32AC-DM-201-227 » Mon Jan 26, 2009 1:09 pm

Very nice info guys!! Thanks Dutch and everyone else for the detailed input. Dose anyone know what the prime mover was in the FL-9AC's ? Was it naturally aspirated, or turbo? Was it built by (EMD)?

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Otto Vondrak
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Re: FL9AC rebuilds and disposition

Post by Otto Vondrak » Mon Jan 26, 2009 1:52 pm

MN-P32AC-DM-201-227 wrote:Very nice info guys!! Thanks Dutch and everyone else for the detailed input. Dose anyone know what the prime mover was in the FL-9AC's ? Was it naturally aspirated, or turbo? Was it built by (EMD)?


One of these:

Image
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FL9AC
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Re: FL9AC rebuilds and disposition

Post by FL9AC » Mon Jan 26, 2009 2:17 pm

It was a turbocharged EMD 710 engine. Here's a few other shots of the block:

Image

Image

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Re: FL9AC rebuilds and disposition

Post by MN-P32AC-DM-201-227 » Mon Jan 26, 2009 3:32 pm

The heart of the beast. Very nice shots FL-9AC,Otto!!! What other locomotives was the 710 used in?

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Tadman
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Re: FL9AC rebuilds and disposition

Post by Tadman » Mon Jan 26, 2009 5:15 pm

Basically an EMD built after 1986-ish. 60-series, 70-series, 75-series, 80-series. The SD9043 I believe used the H-engine. The 710 also went into some MPXpress, but not the Metra order. LIRR's DE/DM series has a 710 I think. Finally, EMD is a big marine engine supplier, so you'll find tugs and freighters with the 710.

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Re: FL9AC rebuilds and disposition

Post by MN-P32AC-DM-201-227 » Tue Jan 27, 2009 9:00 am

Tadman wrote:Basically an EMD built after 1986-ish. 60-series, 70-series, 75-series, 80-series. The SD9043 I believe used the H-engine. The 710 also went into some MPXpress, but not the Metra order. LIRR's DE/DM series has a 710 I think. Finally, EMD is a big marine engine supplier, so you'll find tugs and freighters with the 710.


Thanks Tadman!!

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Otto Vondrak
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Re: FL9AC rebuilds and disposition

Post by Otto Vondrak » Tue Jan 27, 2009 9:39 am

Tadman wrote:Basically an EMD built after 1986-ish. 60-series, 70-series, 75-series, 80-series. The SD9043 I believe used the H-engine. The 710 also went into some MPXpress, but not the Metra order. LIRR's DE/DM series has a 710 I think. Finally, EMD is a big marine engine supplier, so you'll find tugs and freighters with the 710.


Which is why the scrapper surgically removed the prime movers from the FL9AC's... they were barely used, mostly new, and had plenty of re-sale value.

-otto-
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