• Delaware and Raritan River Railroad-General Discussion

  • Pertaining to all railroading subjects, past and present, in New Jersey
Pertaining to all railroading subjects, past and present, in New Jersey

Moderator: David

  by JohnFromJersey
 
If it's not broken down, maybe they are keeping it there for switching purposes? Maybe 752 will take out the empties, make some room for 2005 to drop off the new load, 752 will go back into Woodhaven, and 2005 takes up the empties?
  by Bracdude181
 
JohnFromJersey wrote: Sat Jul 30, 2022 11:59 am If it's not broken down, maybe they are keeping it there for switching purposes? Maybe 752 will take out the empties, make some room for 2005 to drop off the new load, 752 will go back into Woodhaven, and 2005 takes up the empties?
It’s certainly possible. Only thing is, wouldn’t they need Woodhavens permission to park the engine there? I heard they were looking to park both there when operations started kinda like how it is with them parking the engines in Rockport, but I heard Woodhaven was strongly opposed to such an arrangement.

Guess we’ll have to wait and see…
  by baju
 
The 17 car average on the sous probably is a thing of the past. There is a housing crash. Will this affect the building boom in Lakewood? This may put a halt on the clearing and rebuilding of the FIT. Hopefully the sand trains from woodmasnsie will save this project. Any positive thoughts on this?
  by ppbhist
 
Unless we go into a deep recession or a depression, the runaway building in Lakewood and surrounding townships will continue unabated. I've gotten this info from several builders I know in Lakewood. In short, the building boom in Lakewood will continue and Woodhaven will continue to prosper.
  by Bracdude181
 
Even without Lakewoods overdevelopment it won’t be enough to stop Woodhaven. Almost every lumber distributor in Central NJ buys from them.

That, and Lakewood isn’t the only area that’s seeing acres of forest being knocked down for houses. (👎) Millstone in Jackson comes to mind. That entire area is being redeveloped!

The sand trains were supposed to be the shot in the arm that would kick off a major renovation of the Southern Secondary, but who knows if they are even gonna run at this point.
  by RustyRail5634
 
baju wrote: Mon Aug 01, 2022 5:53 pm The 17 car average on the sous probably is a thing of the past. There is a housing crash. Will this affect the building boom in Lakewood? This may put a halt on the clearing and rebuilding of the FIT. Hopefully the sand trains from woodmasnsie will save this project. Any positive thoughts on this?
Full trains are most definitely going to be sparse. Considering Woodhaven can now handle double the capacity for demand that isn't there anymore, it won't happen again for a while likely.
  by Bracdude181
 
@Rustyrail Generally I’ve noticed a pattern. Big trains followed by small trains which gradually increase to big trains again. Although the number one factor of how much Woodhaven gets per train appears to be the price of the material they order when they order it.

The big trains we’ve seen lately may be the result of the big drop in Lumber prices. Woodhaven tends to stockpile stuff when the price drops I’ve noticed, but never as much as they have recently…
  by CharlieL
 
But they've also been selling like crazy, at least in Lakewood Jackson area. We'll see. And I can't see portal getting sand for a couple of years, they have a lot of work to do first. am pretty sure Clayton will bid on it and maybe get some of it. Gateway? that's a few years away. Again, Clayton needs to win a bid. There will probably be more than 1 supplier.

Was hoping Clayton would supply for the Raritan bridge, but I understand that's coming by barge.
  by JohnFromJersey
 
What's the schedule for DRRR on the FIT like? Do they operate on Wednesday's, and if so, what time(s)?
baju wrote: Mon Aug 01, 2022 5:53 pm The 17 car average on the sous probably is a thing of the past. There is a housing crash. This may put a halt on the clearing and rebuilding of the FIT. Hopefully the sand trains from woodmasnsie will save this project. Any positive thoughts on this?
There was a housing crash in 2008, but that didn't mean Woodhaven stopped getting cars nor did it mean CR stopped delivering down here. That being said, a lot of lumber yards, like Gold's Lumber in Farmingdale, Dinasio, 88 Lumber(?), whatever was where Brick Recycling is now, etc. all went bust around that time. Since Woodhaven is the lone survivor of that bunch, I doubt another housing market would do that to them, since they, as others have said here, are the primary lumber supplier for distributors in this area. Not just houses need lumber, but people will still be doing things involving lumber even if society as we know it collapsed tomorrow.
baju wrote: Mon Aug 01, 2022 5:53 pm Will this affect the building boom in Lakewood?
Probably not. The community that drives most of the buildings in Lakewood has a lot of money/capital, and most importantly, is coordinated. It isn't a bunch of individuals doing their own thing in regards to building in Lakewood, it's a close-knit community doing this in an organized manner.

Not to mention, even as the housing market and economy were nose-diving in 2008 and struggled in the ensuing years, Lakewood's expansion due to this community continued to explode.
baju wrote: Mon Aug 01, 2022 5:53 pm This may put a halt on the clearing and rebuilding of the FIT.
I seriously doubt this. Whether the economy is high or low, NJT wants freight off of The Coastline, and ASAP. The FIT-SOUS connection is the only way to do that. In addition, FIT-SOUS being reconnected makes it easier for NJT to look back into MOM or any other similar commuter expansion plans in the future.
baju wrote: Mon Aug 01, 2022 5:53 pm Hopefully the sand trains from woodmasnsie will save this project. Any positive thoughts on this?
Well, considering NJT wants freight off The Coastline, NJT isn't going to allow heavy and long sand trains that probably will run almost every day onto The Coastline. Plus, DRRR received a grant from the state to complete this project, so they have to, or else they'll be in a lot of trouble. I'm sure the state would throw more money at them if need be.

Sand cars wreak havoc on rails, which is why the Southern is in such bad shape compared to the FIT. In addition, NJT allegedly wouldn't allow Brick Recycling to get gondola cars anymore, because they were loading them past the 263,000-pound weight limit that exists on The Coastline south of South Amboy. Gondolas are pretty similar to whatever car they would use to carry the sand (if not the exact car they would use for it), and I doubt they'd be accurately measuring the sand when they load it onto the cars, so there would certainly be issues there.

Once FIT-SOUS is connected, the weight limit is a proper 286,000 pounds, so there shouldn't be any issue there, and we can finally see sand trains rolling.

In addition, Clayton's potential customers aren't just the Gateway tunnels. There's tons of other potential customers we don't know of throughout the state I bet, not to mention there are three potential customers on the FIT and SOUS. One of which is serviceable right now but doesn't have a siding (Stavola in Tinton Falls), and two which are on the OOS FIT portion that needs the work done first (Stavola's other location and L&L paving, both in Howell) .
  by R&DB
 
#1603645 by JohnFromJersey
Tue Aug 02, 2022 12:24 am
There is another possible customer for sand: Cambridge Paving Stones in Lakewood. They even have most of a siding, just need a switch.
  by pumpers
 
So all the bridges on the SOuthern from Farmingdale down to Clayton are rated 286K? (and the Freehold Branch, NJT Raritan River bridge, etc?). The above post implies that's the case.

There are some trestles down around Lakewood - I wonder when and why they ever upgraded them (assuming they weren't built originally for 286K), given there was no way to get to them.
  by nomis
 
Pumpers, Wasn’t that a part of the three bridges work that Conrail received quite a few years ago for the SOUS from NJ Freight Rail Grant program?
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