Connecticut New Haven Line and Shore Line East Service Levels and Cuts

Amtrak is currently in the process of stringing catenary on track 6. I heard the prediction is December.

daybeers wrote: ↑Thu Sep 26, 2024 8:28 pmAmtrak is currently in the process of stringing catenary on track 6. I heard the prediction is December.

Nice!

ElectricTraction wrote: ↑Thu Sep 26, 2024 2:37 pm SLE seems like a good candidate for OPTO if they could ever get all the stakeholders to agree to it. They'd also need to modernize the ticketing system to proof of payment, not the ancient ticket system that seems to live on like a zombie in the Northeast. With OPTO and electric MUs, the cost to add trains should be really, really low. They're not guzzling 55 gallons/hour of diesel idling anymore or getting 4GPM with 1972 EMD 645-16 turbos like they used to.

Even requiring a separate engineer and conductor, it seems like the marginal cost to add runs with the M-8s should be quite low.

Forgetting the regulatory reasons for a moment, OPTO is not able to happen on SLE also because none of the platforms can fully hold a 4-car train except NHV and OSB. The door controls would permit opening only two cars ahead of the middle cab or two cars behind. That's why the conductor and trainmen manually key open individual doors on SLE.

Silverliner II wrote: ↑Fri Sep 27, 2024 6:19 pmForgetting the regulatory reasons for a moment, OPTO is not able to happen on SLE also because none of the platforms can fully hold a 4-car train except NHV and OSB. The door controls would permit opening only two cars ahead of the middle cab or two cars behind. That's why the conductor and trainmen manually key open individual doors on SLE.

Welp, that's some great design in the door control systems. MN must really have fun platforming a 9-car set on a 5- or 6-car platform.

ElectricTraction wrote: ↑Fri Sep 27, 2024 7:04 pm

Silverliner II wrote: ↑Fri Sep 27, 2024 6:19 pmForgetting the regulatory reasons for a moment, OPTO is not able to happen on SLE also because none of the platforms can fully hold a 4-car train except NHV and OSB. The door controls would permit opening only two cars ahead of the middle cab or two cars behind. That's why the conductor and trainmen manually key open individual doors on SLE.

Welp, that's some great design in the door control systems. MN must really have fun platforming a 9-car set on a 5- or 6-car platform.

That's when they only open doors on the head or rear 4 cars, accordingly. Same with the LIRR. Or even SEPTA and NJT when they open doors on short platforms via a trainline command.

I didn't observe the door opening procedure at Clinton. It was a four-car "SLE" set, so I assume they just opened two door. Strange they didn't build a full four-car platform.

Silverliner II wrote: ↑Fri Sep 27, 2024 11:07 pmThat's when they only open doors on the head or rear 4 cars, accordingly. Same with the LIRR. Or even SEPTA and NJT when they open doors on short platforms via a trainline command.

I haven't ridden down to NYC for a while, but IIRC, they would hang one car in front and two off the back at Milford. Or maybe it was two and two? Not sure exactly how the doors line up. So how do they handle that if SLE can't do it?

ElectricTraction wrote:

Silverliner II wrote: ↑Fri Sep 27, 2024 11:07 pmThat's when they only open doors on the head or rear 4 cars, accordingly. Same with the LIRR. Or even SEPTA and NJT when they open doors on short platforms via a trainline command.

I haven't ridden down to NYC for a while, but IIRC, they would hang one car in front and two off the back at Milford. Or maybe it was two and two? Not sure exactly how the doors line up. So how do they handle that if SLE can't do it?

On inbounds, the front however many cars always platform. It makes it more crowded in the front four cars but walking back for a seat is easier than gambling on which side of the train will have seats. On outbounds, they usually balance it out - for example, the front two and back two do not platform at Fairfield. They're usually good about communicating this, but I have nearly missed my stop on times they don't.

SLE typically platforms the middle two cars.

ElectricTraction wrote:SLE seems like a good candidate for OPTO if they could ever get all the stakeholders to agree to it. They'd also need to modernize the ticketing system to proof of payment, not the ancient ticket system that seems to live on like a zombie in the Northeast. With OPTO and electric MUs, the cost to add trains should be really, really low. They're not guzzling 55 gallons/hour of diesel idling anymore or getting 4GPM with 1972 EMD 645-16 turbos like they used to.

Even requiring a separate engineer and conductor, it seems like the marginal cost to add runs with the M-8s should be quite low.

M8 operation is considerably more expensive than diesels for SLE. Amtrak charges an arm and a leg for electricity. If SLE used two car sets it'd be a lot better, but alas they still use four when ridership only warrants that on holiday weekends. IIRC, with current funding levels SLE could run 3-4 more round trips if they used diesel...but now there is no longer enough spare diesel equipment to go around, especially with MNR using the GP40s.

FWIW, the use of diesel is why they're able to run Stamford service. The additional appropriation was only supposed to allow two New Haven-New London round trips. By using a diesel, they can afford to run Stamford. My only complaint would be if they use the diesel for the far longer Stamford trip instead of running that with M8s and putting the diesel on 1645/1634, which already are scheduled for longer run times.

Traingeek3629 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2024 7:33 pm IIRC, with current funding levels SLE could run 3-4 more round trips if they used diesel...but now there is no longer enough spare diesel equipment to go around, especially with MNR using the GP40s.

There's a glut of diesel equipment to work with. They've got 33 of the 38 Mafersa coaches built, according to my latest roster (the five missing coaches are all trailers that were purchased by a mining outfit in Quebec that uses them as an employee commuter train). And I thought MNR only leased 3 or 4 of the Geeps. That still leaves CDOT with 14 locomotives to use with 8 sets of equipment (based on all being 4-car sets) or 10 sets of equipment (based on all being 3-car sets). So even if MNR leased all the Geeps, that still leaves CDOT with more locomotives than trainsets to work with. As it is, under current schedules, I've never seen more than 3 sets of equipment in use on the Hartford Line at any given time, and let's assume one set on SLE subbing for an M8 set. That still leaves them with more than enough equipment to restore the Stamford trains as well as the rest of the NHV-OSB trips that ran pre-pandemic.

Traingeek3629 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2024 7:33 pmOn inbounds, the front however many cars always platform. It makes it more crowded in the front four cars but walking back for a seat is easier than gambling on which side of the train will have seats. On outbounds, they usually balance it out - for example, the front two and back two do not platform at Fairfield. They're usually good about communicating this, but I have nearly missed my stop on times they don't.

SLE typically platforms the middle two cars.

So how do they open the correct doors?

M8 operation is considerably more expensive than diesels for SLE. Amtrak charges an arm and a leg for electricity. If SLE used two car sets it'd be a lot better, but alas they still use four when ridership only warrants that on holiday weekends. IIRC, with current funding levels SLE could run 3-4 more round trips if they used diesel...but now there is no longer enough spare diesel equipment to go around, especially with MNR using the GP40s.

WHAT? How much is Amtrak marking up the cost of electricity?!? Even at the retail rate the consumers pay, which is surely much higher than what Amtrak is paying, the electricity cost to run an M-8 set is a small fraction of what a diesel guzzling GP-40-3H or P40DC is consuming.

FWIW, the use of diesel is why they're able to run Stamford service. The additional appropriation was only supposed to allow two New Haven-New London round trips. By using a diesel, they can afford to run Stamford. My only complaint would be if they use the diesel for the far longer Stamford trip instead of running that with M8s and putting the diesel on 1645/1634, which already are scheduled for longer run times.

That is an obscene policy failure. You've got the federal government massively overcharging the state government for electricity to such an extreme that running dirty diesel ends up being cheaper?!?

I know Amtrak's electricity fees are high, but I don't know if 3-4 round trips is correct. I know it was a factor in MARC choosing to buy more Chargers instead of replacing the HHP-8s with other electrics, but that's also likely MTA Maryland management in general, as well as the fact that Amtrak's Sprinters will be sold off once the Airos come online. It's easier and cheaper for MARC to have one or two diesel models to maintain for use on all three lines instead of adding an electric into the mix, however silly that may sound. The electricity/fuel equation is off in this country.

I'd wager the need for both a conductor and an AC on each SLE run definitely increases costs.

ElectricTraction wrote: ↑Mon Sep 30, 2024 6:00 pm

Traingeek3629 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2024 7:33 pmOn inbounds, the front however many cars always platform. It makes it more crowded in the front four cars but walking back for a seat is easier than gambling on which side of the train will have seats. On outbounds, they usually balance it out - for example, the front two and back two do not platform at Fairfield. They're usually good about communicating this, but I have nearly missed my stop on times they don't.

SLE typically platforms the middle two cars.

So how do they open the correct doors?

On SLE, a crew member in each car manually keys the doors open and closed in these cases; they don't use the door control panels in the cabs.

https://mailchi.mp/shorelineeast/302130 ... 498e7f534d

Greetings CTrail Shore Line East Customers,

We are happy to inform you that additional service will be available between New London and Stamford starting Monday, October 7. Four new trains were added, and one existing train now extends to Stamford.

Please take note of the following changes:

Westbound (To New Haven)
NEW CTrail 1633 - A new through train departing New London at 5:46 a.m. and arriving in Stamford at 7:53 a.m.
NEW CTrail 1695 - Departs New London at 9:05 p.m.
Eastbound (To Old Saybrook and New London)
NEW CTrail 1600 - A new early-morning train departing New Haven Union Station at 4:25 a.m.
CTrail 1638 - A through train departing Stamford at 4:13 p.m. and arriving at New London at 6:25 p.m.
NEW CTrail 1640 - A new train departing New Haven Union Station at 7:45 p.m.
Note that Metro-North and Amtrak connections may have changed. Please visit shorelineeast.com/schedules for the full schedule.

Remember to review your preferences on our alerts page to ensure you receive the most up-to-date travel information. Preferences may need to be updated after each schedule change.

Thank you,

Connecticut Department of Transportation

Silverliner II wrote: ↑Mon Sep 30, 2024 8:50 pmOn SLE, a crew member in each car manually keys the doors open and closed in these cases; they don't use the door control panels in the cabs.

So.... how does MN do it on a 9-car set?

ElectricTraction wrote: ↑Tue Oct 01, 2024 6:42 pm

Silverliner II wrote: ↑Mon Sep 30, 2024 8:50 pmOn SLE, a crew member in each car manually keys the doors open and closed in these cases; they don't use the door control panels in the cabs.

So.... how does MN do it on a 9-car set?

Same as with a train of any other length, be it anywhere from 4 to 10 cars. They'll platform whatever fits and work from the cab nearest to the end of the platform, so if a platform fits 8 cars, and they have a 9 car train, and they platform the head 8 cars, the single car would be either the 3rd, 5th, or 7th car. The conductor would be in the cab of the 8th car and open up the 7 cars ahead of his position. Rear two would have to walk forward**

**if the door control panels have a 'local door' button that would open both doors on only that car, then the conductor would use that to open up the doors on the 8th car, and only the folks in the 9th would have to walk ahead.