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Commission proposes $117 billion to remake the Northeast Corridor

Discussion related to Amtrak also known as the National Railroad Passenger Corp.

Moderators: GirlOnTheTrain, mtuandrew, Tadman

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Re: Commission proposes $117 billion to remake the Northeast Corridor

 #1576009  by Gilbert B Norman
 
Mr. R&DB, while not disputing the importance of the Baltimore tunnels, the Hudson (North) River tunnels must be considered a "top ten" projects on anybody's infrastructure laundry list (must put it behind that bridge in Memphis that came too close to having folks swimming in "Ol' Man River"). I can recall a Sep '76 incident when the PC spilled a freight blocking both Baltimore tunnels. Busteetoots were quickly established and life went on.

If the North River tunnels were to spring a leak - even if just one - I can't begin to imagine the disruption that would occur. When Penn Station needed repaids, there was still some service; it was Summer and I'll bet some commuters from NJ actually enjoyed the ferryboat ride X the Hudson.

And finally, lest we forget; even if the contract was let for the new tunnels tomorrow, we're still talking five to seven years for completion.

Re: Commission proposes $117 billion to remake the Northeast Corridor

 #1576015  by R&DB
 
Mr Norman wrote:
I'll bet some commuters from NJ actually enjoyed the ferryboat ride X the Hudson.
While not a commuter at that time, I always preferred the boats to the tubes. Up until '67 the CNJ to the ferry was my favorite way to get to NYC.

Re: Commission proposes $117 billion to remake the Northeast Corridor

 #1576061  by STrRedWolf
 
I think the main point here of this plan is simple:

We have infrastructure that is going to fail almost at any moment and it will disrupt everything when it does. We MUST repair or replace. Doing nothing will only make it worse... but while we are, lets improve it.

That's what I'm seeing out of this plan. Just from DC to Perryville, you got the B&P, two bridges, and then you get 4-track expansions and projects to get commuter rail out of Amtrak's hair ASAP. Lots of little things that add up to a lot in the long term. It's all worth it.

And for those who balk? It's only going to cost more in the future.

Re: Commission proposes $117 billion to remake the Northeast Corridor

 #1576077  by ExCon90
 
Hear, hear on that; however, it's being reported elsewhere that Merry Andrew wants to withhold New York's contribution unless the work is confined to nights and weekends (!), a la the 14th St-Canarsie line. Let's hope some people can talk sense into him and help him understand that the consultant's recommendation just won't work and a full-bore -- as it were -- shutdown will be necessary, requiring at least one new tunnel to be in service first. (Looks like London Bridge has fallen down on that one.)

Re: Commission proposes $117 billion to remake the Northeast Corridor

 #1576090  by njtmnrrbuff
 
I definately agree that the Gateway Project and replacement of the Baltimore tunnels are vital. On the stretch of the NEC that is shared with Metro North on the New Haven Line, I can't stress enough how important it is to replace many of the river bridges. That's part of what's slowing both MNR and Amtrak trains down.

Re: Commission proposes $117 billion to remake the Northeast Corridor

 #1576122  by SRich
 
R&DB wrote: ↑Thu Jul 15, 2021 9:21 pm 3 things:
1> Hudsen River
2> Baltimore Tunnels
3> 3 tracks minimum Was-Bos; preferably 4 or more.

A fewother items, not critical but desirable:
minimize commuter trains
ban freight
straighten curves
extend to Richmond
A better option is Was - Bos 4 tracks.
The Gateway project. And the new Double stack Baltimore Tunnels. And single Amtrak ownership and control of the whole line.

Then a second idea
Build under the current NY penn a second layer. With 20 tracks and platforms. And 8 new tunnels(4 on each side) under the current ones. Make it high enough that Double stack and superliners can run thru. If its build then the current first layer can completely rebuild with large platforms for NJ/LIRR and Metro-North

:wink:

Re: Commission proposes $117 billion to remake the Northeast Corridor

 #1576140  by electricron
 
More direct links from the NEC Commission
http://nec-commission.com/app/uploads/2 ... y-Only.pdf
http://nec-commission.com/app/uploads/2 ... 5-Plan.pdf

Around $100 Billion in funds needed for the $117 Billion plan is unfunded.
They recommend changing entirely how the Federal government funds transportation projects, including a special commission solely for the NEC. Yet there is no recommendations changing how the local transit agencies should fund themselves, or how States should change the way they fund transportation projects. Nothing mentioned at all on how the costs should be shared, they expect Uncle Sam to pay all the remaining unfunded money, without any safeguards for cost overruns.

Good luck with that!

Re: Commission proposes $117 billion to remake the Northeast Corridor

 #1576144  by RRspatch
 
As someone who frequently rode the headend of trains through the B&P tunnel and seeing water seeping/running out of the walls I'm amazed it's still standing. Amtrak used to have a special truck in Baltimore that went in at least once a week to pump grout into the walls.

Re: Commission proposes $117 billion to remake the Northeast Corridor

 #1576151  by west point
 
IMO it is a toss up between the new Gateway tunnel bores and new B & P bores. Both projects have to have 2 bores each in service to allow for the required cross passageways ~ every 800 feet for emergency evacuation. Either tunnel with a present failure will be a disaster but B&P can probably be temporarily restored faster?

Now IMO next will be starting the Long bridge 2nd bridge . Mainly since the final EIS is done and contracts to start work may be quickly initiated. B&P may take somewhat longer to start ? Additional service can start to Richmond as soon as Long Bridge is complete?

Re: Commission proposes $117 billion to remake the Northeast Corridor

 #1576227  by scratchyX1
 
west point wrote: ↑Sun Jul 18, 2021 1:16 am IMO it is a toss up between the new Gateway tunnel bores and new B & P bores. Both projects have to have 2 bores each in service to allow for the required cross passageways ~ every 800 feet for emergency evacuation. Either tunnel with a present failure will be a disaster but B&P can probably be temporarily restored faster?

Now IMO next will be starting the Long bridge 2nd bridge . Mainly since the final EIS is done and contracts to start work may be quickly initiated. B&P may take somewhat longer to start ? Additional service can start to Richmond as soon as Long Bridge is complete?
Rather that having 2 bores for the 4 a week diesel double stacks of NS, just give them trackage rights and restored connections at Orangeville and Claremont to the just rebuilt CSX tunnel.
I still think ground up reconstruction of the B&P tunnels (without having to rush for trains) for MARC, to have connections with subway and light rail, would make more sense, long run.
at the same time, having even 2 tracks with 60MPH MAS will make all trips faster and more reliable.
and then 4 tracks, Balt to DC.
I thought there was 2-3 additional slots currently not used for long bridge?
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