Binghamton NY - New York City NYC Passenger Rail Discussion

Sorry Dutch, you're all wrong on this one.

They do one of these studies every 3 or 4 years. That's the great thing about being a politician, just ask for a new study and look like you did something and you care.

Dutch is right on one thing, Schumer's a lot of hot air.


I predict you'll be able to take a train from Syracuse to Binghamton, Scranton, and over the cutoff to NYC somewhere around 2110. That's about when the Cutoff will be built, and the bridge over Park Street in Syracuse finished.

henry6 wrote:And Railbus, the dollars to be spent are well worth it.

Are these studies available online?

Dutch is on to something here. This proposal is for a region of New York State which has been NEGLECTED for decades, and it's time for the Democrats to go fishing for votes.

The promise will be waved, the votes will be cast, and like all of Hillary's programs, there will yet again be NO RESULT. I agree, it doesn't look like Chucky knows what he's getting himself into, hence the cover story of initiating a STUDY.

Discussion of The Cutoff IS RELEVANT to this thread because it's reconstruction is a critical contingent to this proposal becoming a reality. No Cutoff in another State, no rail service to Binghamton. To write off discussion of The Cutoff here just because it's in another State is myopic.

Someone made a remark about a need for improved/expanded passenger service in the corridor between Buffalo and Syracuse? It exists, and there's no leg to stand on for expansion of services until the existing trains are SRO.

This proposal by Schumer, though IMO clearly politically motivated as all the previous ones have been, is for a part of the State that's been virtually written-off for too long. Let's get passenger service back to see what happens. If it doesn't have the desired effect, oh well, nobody can say it was never tried.

D/

If you read what I wrote, then you would understand that Mr. Schumer is doing the next thing that has to be done in order for us to continue with this.. His participation in our project has been continuing for several years and is not just a grab your guns political move. The project has been supported and progressed with bipartisan plolitical support. This area is slowly realizing the changes they must make in their thinking about the future. Other areas, like Scranton PA, North Adams MA, and Syracuse NY, have started to move on from economic devistation by throwing out the past and embracing something new for the future, and so now is BInghamton, Elmira, and other parts of NY's Southern Tier. The impact of a crumbling and inadequate highway infrastructure means decisions have to be made as to how to spend money not just for people to move about but also how to move volumes of freight into, out of and through. Other factors include lack of direct air service to and from NYC and weather conditions from severe fog to frequent rain to heavy snow which often makes flying and driving hazardous at best, impossible at worst. An interesting geographic factor is that to access the Southern Tier of NY from any direction, mountainous terrain with elevations into the 2000 ft range have to be overcome unless one follows the very circutious Susquehanna River. Cost factors? Viability of ideas? All have to be searched out through very long and laborious political processes today. Gone are the days a railroad baron plows through towns and villages on the way to his riches. Today we must rely on ourselves to do what we must to find the keys to our future.

One thing I've noticed is that they mention operating Binghamton-Hoboken. I don't think Amtrak would have desire to operate a second terminal in the NYC area. If NYS is serious about funding this look for dual-modes to operate the service or NYS to pay somewhat for the cutoff to be electrified to Scranton so Amtrak can maintain an engine terminal and perform the engine change without disrupting NJT or the town of Dover, NJ.

There are so many problems with this that its not even funny... You're right, this would require a huge investment by Amtrak for a service that may very well be a flop. They would either have to create a second terminal in Hoboken, get some sort of so far uninvented dual mode that can make it through the tunnels, or have an engine change around Dover. The other funny thing is, looking at NJT's schedule, even with the most express trains it takes over 1 1/2 hours to get from Hopatcong to Hoboken... couple that with PATH transfer times and the time to get to 33rd street and you are close to 2 hours. That gives this new service just about 1 hour and 15 minutes to get from Hopatcong to Binghamton to be competitive with buses. I think you'd need a Japanese bullet train for that run.

This is a huge problem with the Lackawanna Cutoff project in itself. If NJT cannot run trains in a time competitive fashion even as far as Scranton, I think residents there would rather drive to a closer destination to board a train to NYC or just drive there themselves. With the pace that the Lackawanna Cutoff is moving at, I'd say it is a minimum of 10-15 years away at best if it ever happens.

SecaucusJunction wrote: I think residents there would rather drive to a closer destination to board a train to NYC or just drive there themselves. With the pace that the Lackawanna Cutoff is moving at, I'd say it is a minimum of 10-15 years away at best if it ever happens.

I have been doing that my entire life..
and it works fine!
If I want to visit New York City, I take the thruway or Route 17 to an outlying Metro North station, leave the car there and take the train into the city.

Best of both worlds that way..Drive most of the way, which is much faster and more convenient than Amtrak from Western NY, then take the train right into Grand Central, which is MUCH better than driving your own car anywhere near New York City..

Lets say Binghamton to Beacon..according to google maps thats 143 miles. Its expressway the whole way, so at 75mph thats a 2 hour drive.
then Beacon to Grand Central on Metro North is 90 minutes.
3.5 to 4 hours total for the trip..and fairly painless.

anyone know how fast the DL&W used to do NYC to Binghamton??

Scot

If you want to get it done, leave Amtrak out. I've read that elsewhere on here, Amtrak would not want or need a 2nd NY terminal. NJT is the best fit for an operator, just like on Pascak and Port Jervis, since they are the end destination. Bring back the Phoebe Snow!

SecaucusJunction wrote:....and you are close to 2 hours. That gives this new service just about 1 hour and 15 minutes to get from Hopatcong to Binghamton to be competitive with buses.

I am looking at a 1950 DL&W timetable and typical Slateford Junction to Binghamton times are 3 to 3 1/2 hours. Hopatcong to Slateford Junction is about another 30 minutes so you are looking at a ride of well over 5 hours Binghamton to New York City by train to compete with a 3 hour and 15 minute, $39 bus ride.

You are all so far off in your thinking, postulations and pontifications it isn't even funny, just scarey. Not one of you know a thing about what this is all about, i.e., the economics, the politics, the environmental aspectse et al., nor know the real history of railroads and the region.

I'm for the service (after all, I am a foamer ), but just because someone is pointing out the hurdles and formulating an opinion doesn't mean you have to get all huffy. If memory serves me, you were the same way on the PSA thread on the MNRR forum. I respect opposing view-points, after all, this is a FORUM, isn't it?

But there have been no "views", just uninformed opinions.

why would they need a whole new terminal for a handful of trains? Either they use 1 track in hoboken, or use NYP with an engine change in Dover.

I don't see Amtrak using Hoboken considering they wanted out of GCT. It's actually cheaper to simply use NYP then to setup servicing and ticketing at Hoboken. How would the engine change be performed in Dover?