• Amtrak NEC Delay and Service Disruption Thread

  • Discussion related to Amtrak also known as the National Railroad Passenger Corp.
Discussion related to Amtrak also known as the National Railroad Passenger Corp.

Moderators: GirlOnTheTrain, mtuandrew, Tadman

  by TheOneKEA
 
I just witnessed NS 4380 leading #196 into Ashland station on the near track to make a regular station stop. It sounded like the prime mover in 196 was running but does anyone know what the casualty was in the Genesis to require an NS loco to lead?
  by twropr
 
#1645300 by TheOneKEA
Sat Jun 01, 2024 2:13 pm
I just witnessed NS 4380 leading #196 into Ashland station on the near track to make a regular station stop. It sounded like the prime mover in 196 was running but does anyone know what the casualty was in the Genesis to require an NS loco to lead?

Was this a southbound train? 4380 had rescued train 84 from Norfolk on May 31 due to some kind of problem with P42 22. The train you saw may have been returning 4380 from Washington to a point where it could be dropped off for NS to pick up.
Andy
  by TheOneKEA
 
twropr wrote: Sun Jun 02, 2024 7:49 pm #1645300 by TheOneKEA
Sat Jun 01, 2024 2:13 pm
I just witnessed NS 4380 leading #196 into Ashland station on the near track to make a regular station stop. It sounded like the prime mover in 196 was running but does anyone know what the casualty was in the Genesis to require an NS loco to lead?

Was this a southbound train? 4380 had rescued train 84 from Norfolk on May 31 due to some kind of problem with P42 22. The train you saw may have been returning 4380 from Washington to a point where it could be dropped off for NS to pick up.
Andy
Yes, it was heading southbound when I saw it on Virtual Railfan’s livestream. How does this sort of loco exchange generally work? Would 4380 have been operated by an NS crew with an Amtrak pilot engineer?
  by CNJGeep
 
Amtrak crew.
NS delivers it, Amtrak runs it, Amtrak drops it off.
  by Ken W2KB
 
"NJ Transit commuters were hit with 45 minute delays on train lines to New York City Friday morning due to Amtrak track work, ending a week of infrastructure problems that made for tough travel."https://www.nj.com/news/2024/06/major-d ... lw0MHiJzgl
  by lensovet
 
JuniusLivonius wrote: Thu May 23, 2024 8:15 pm
bellstbarn wrote: Thu May 23, 2024 9:55 am WABC said "Kearny," so we know it's not Harrison or Secaucus. Public relations could have given a milepost number but that may require an explanation of milepost numbers and where zero is.
I'm just a guy sitting here listening to NEC road radio. On April 15th I don't believe they said much beyond "Amtrak overhead wire issues near Metuchen" when within 5 minutes I already knew the severity of the issue: 3 trains broke their pantographs (either all or some). One left maybe an hour later with its other pantograph, but the other two on tracks 2 and 4 weren't even towed away until after midnight. The catenary on track 1 was the only one left and was begging for its life, so every train ran through track 1.

I wish they would at least communicate the severity so people could understand what's happening and why. They could literally just hire one person to sit in PSCC and take notes. Yet, I've seen that NJ transit can't even properly communicate low leveling and often announces the wrong thing.
You do realize that the vast majority of the traveling public have no idea what a pantograph even is?

All they need to be told is that traffic is halted and they should look for other plans.
  by JuniusLivonius
 
lensovet wrote: Sun Jun 09, 2024 4:27 pm You do realize that the vast majority of the traveling public have no idea what a pantograph even is?

All they need to be told is that traffic is halted and they should look for other plans.
I see. Sometimes we get lost in the hobby/industry/trade and forget that the there are people outside of it.

So in that case it could be something like "downed wires" and "3 disabled trains". I don't know how other people interpret that but I'm much more sympathetic if I know there are 3 or 4 simultaneous issues (May 22) - the downed tunnel wires, the signal power, the downed wires in Kearny and the downed wires near the airport.

I don't know the right approach and it's probably true that few people care. Besides that, there's not really a complete followup of what happened by Amtrak or NJT. A formal summary would be great for accountability reasons rather than only getting a summary from an interview made with only a New York Times writer.
  by STrRedWolf
 
JuniusLivonius wrote: Wed Jun 12, 2024 10:45 pm
lensovet wrote: Sun Jun 09, 2024 4:27 pm You do realize that the vast majority of the traveling public have no idea what a pantograph even is?

All they need to be told is that traffic is halted and they should look for other plans.
I see. Sometimes we get lost in the hobby/industry/trade and forget that the there are people outside of it.

So in that case it could be something like "downed wires" and "3 disabled trains". I don't know how other people interpret that but I'm much more sympathetic if I know there are 3 or 4 simultaneous issues (May 22) - the downed tunnel wires, the signal power, the downed wires in Kearny and the downed wires near the airport.

I don't know the right approach and it's probably true that few people care. Besides that, there's not really a complete followup of what happened by Amtrak or NJT. A formal summary would be great for accountability reasons rather than only getting a summary from an interview made with only a New York Times writer.
Maybe we need what one person I know has done with SEPTA, and create a site which makes it super simple.

https://technical.ly/software-developme ... rbo-fcked/

In other words, is Amtrak/NJ Transit ****ed?
  by JuniusLivonius
 
New Summer of Hell?

Regarding today's issues in NJ

2:10:10PM Section A dispatcher asked if a train said they lost power on both power cars coming through Swift (repeating back what the engineer said)

With two power cars, it was certainly an Acela, so it was #2108. It got stuck just short of the Portal bridge and stopped showing on the map after 2 hours at 4:32PM: https://asm.transitdocs.com/train/2024/06/20/A/2108

I don't know if #2108 got rescued, towed or is still out there. Edit: likely left on its own but is no longer tracked


2:10:46PM Section A dispatcher asked if NJT #5176 said they heard a loud boom east of Erie on 3 track (repeating back what the engineer said)

Erie (interlocking) is at the eastern edge of Secaucus Junction putting that right where the brush fire is. The relation between the brush fire and the loss of train power remains to be explained.

How this affected the Penn Station area itself also remains to be explained. NY Penn traction power comes through the tunnels under both rivers.
Last edited by JuniusLivonius on Thu Jun 20, 2024 6:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
  by Erie-Lackawanna
 
All catenary power was out from Philadelphia to NY (assume GATE on the Hell Gate) due to a breaker overload at the Hackensack substation. Service was restored shortly before 17:30; 2121 departed NYP at 17:29, 3h14m late.

They’re about 20 years (and counting) too late on replacing all that ancient 25 cycle crap with modern, reliable 60 cycle commercial power.
  by JuniusLivonius
 
Erie-Lackawanna wrote: Thu Jun 20, 2024 6:12 pm All catenary power was out from Philadelphia to NY (assume GATE on the Hell Gate) due to a breaker overload at the Hackensack substation. Service was restored shortly before 17:30; 2121 departed NYP at 17:29, 3h14m late.

They’re about 20 years (and counting) too late on replacing all that ancient 25 cycle crap with modern, reliable 60 cycle commercial power.
Interesting. Could that be the pop #5176 heard after they passed Secaucus?

Is the system able to separated into two islands?

Speaking of #2121, they said they had 5 MCB trips before 6:06PM and based on the fact that I heard it, they were in the Metropark area. Undervoltage maybe?
  by TheOneKEA
 
Erie-Lackawanna wrote: Thu Jun 20, 2024 6:12 pm All catenary power was out from Philadelphia to NY (assume GATE on the Hell Gate) due to a breaker overload at the Hackensack substation. Service was restored shortly before 17:30; 2121 departed NYP at 17:29, 3h14m late.

They’re about 20 years (and counting) too late on replacing all that ancient 25 cycle crap with modern, reliable 60 cycle commercial power.
25Hz is not ancient, but it is obsolescent. Most of the ancient PRR-era transformers, switchgear and control gear at the lineside substations has already been replaced or is being replaced with new-build equipment. There is nothing inherently unreliable about 25Hz electrical circuitry; it's just heavier for the same apparent power output. In any case, the overall cost for replacing the 25Hz electrification would be so fantastically high, and the replacement system so much less resilient in the face of certain types of problems, that it will likely endure as long as the German 16.7Hz electrification.
JuniusLivonius wrote: Thu Jun 20, 2024 6:28 pm Is the system able to separated into two islands?
Not in NJ. There are only three sets of 138kV circuit breakers in the entire PRR transmission network, and they are located at Zoo, Perryville and Thorndale. The 12kV catenary can potentially be separated into islands by tripping the catenary breakers at the substations and opening various section switches to isolate the catenary.
  by Gilbert B Norman
 
To cover today's incident, looks like NBC News set their reporter up in the Long Island concourse of Penn:

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/nj ... rcna158173

That "echo chamber" public address system remains as deafening as I knew it to be some sixty years ago. Of course, those around here who ride the L I R R regularly know that "charm school" is simply not part of public contact employees' curriculum.
  by STrRedWolf
 
The hits keep coming one at a time...

A NJTransit train broke down in Penn Station around 8:27a today, blocking a tunnel and access to the Empire line. NJ Transit says it's a caternary problem. So...
  • No NJ Traffic into NYP.
  • Keystones being restricted
  • NEC trains being canceled or truncated.
  by PRRTechFan
 
Yeah, something isn't right about all these power issues. A single tripped breaker does NOT take out the entire NEC between Philadelphia and Long Island. Every substation has 4- 132kv feeders, at least 2 - 132kv/13kv step-down transformers, two 13kv busses with individual breakers for every catenary circuit and a buss tie breaker. 132kv in New Jersey primarily comes from frequency converters at the PSE&G Metuchen switching station in Edison. Penn Station northward comes from frequency converters powered from Con Edison. There used to be a phase break just outside the tunnels on the NJ side, and they could close a tie there if necessary. It is also hard, but not impossible; to understand how one single disabled train can block every movement in and out of NYP; although there ARE a couple of places that this could happen. It's like all the stars aligned against the NEC in Secaucus this week!
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