• Discussion of products from the American Locomotive Company. A web site with current Alco 251 information can be found here: Fairbanks-Morse/Alco 251.
Discussion of products from the American Locomotive Company. A web site with current Alco 251 information can be found here: Fairbanks-Morse/Alco 251.

Moderator: Alcoman

  by Alcoman
For those you who are invovled in museums in the New York State area, you may be interested to know that the MOHAWK & HUDSON Chapter NRHS is considering the sale or donation of its equpment collection according to a member of the group. They were to have a meeting yesterday 9/24/05 to discuss it with their remaining members (-20 members).
I am presently trying to find out more about the meeting and any plans that have been made which I will report here as soon as I learn more details.
Here is what they have:
NYC RS-3 # 126 ex-Amtrak 126,nee NYC 8254
NYC T3a electric,nee-NYC 278
NYC S-1 electric # 100, Nee-NYC 6000
NYC GE U25B # 2510,Nee- NYC 2510

In addition, they own some equipment that is ex-D&H/B&M at the Colonie yard. The above is kept at the Glenmont power plant siding.

This equipment needs a good home and alot of TLC. The S-1 electric is one of 2-3 that exsist while the T3a is a 1 of a kind left.
The RS-3 and U25B were stored serviceable however their current condition is unknown.

More information coming soon.

  by Alcoman

The M&H did not have a business meeting as planned, but a informal disussion revealed that something will have to be done soon as the power company wants the equipment removed.

  by GN 599
Please keep us posted Alcoman. Chances are very good I can find a home for the U25 and or the RS3.

If the RS-3 has roller bearings, I would be interested in buying it, or making a "donation" to the chapter. Keep us informed. Regards :wink:

  by Paul
The NYC 8554 was in deplorable condition when I last saw it back in 1990 or so. I know the air brake valves have been removed from inside the cab, not sure about the rest below the cab. I had contacted M&H years ago about the possable purchase of this unit. I doubt the stack was covered, and of course there is that vandalism thing as well. What a shame. I worked on the sister 8255 and had a vision of them running together with the 8223 on the ADCX. Oh well. Of course I will need to put a bid in if she can be moved, but I doubt she is worth anything more than scrap value at this point.
The U-25? Why would anybody waiste time on that piece of junk?

  by Alcoman
I myself would like to see the units stay with NY State. My first choice for the RS-3 and the U25B would be the Adirondack Scenic. This is based that they need more power to operate their growing operation. Since it is ex-NYC track, it would be a good match.

Another option is to send the RS-3 to the D-L who I know would give it the TLC it needs. The U25B could still go to the Adirondack or as a static display in Rochester at the Museum there.

The S and T motor would museum pieces that would have to be placed indoors for safe keeping. Maybe the NY State Museum?

Just my 2 cents. The final plan is strickly up to the M&H Chapter.
  by H.F.Malone
The NYC U-boat has a frozen (rusted) engine-- it didn't bar over when tried, five years ago. The thin sheet metal on the early U-boats does not hold up too well to long-term exposure to the weather, especially if the unit is neglected and not cared-for, so the carbody is quite rusted. The RS-3 body metal probably is better, but who knows about the rest of it.

Unfortunately, these locomotives will most probably be scrapped (and hopefully some parts will be saved--there's some demand for 598 main gens from C425 operators) on-site. The real gems are the two NYC electrics, and they will be the most difficult to move, either on their own wheels or by truck. M&H waited too long to decide to find new homes for this stuff, as the movement of "weird" stuff on modern railroads has recently gotten to be almost impossible (and don't lecture me about how none of this is "weird"-- I know that, but the railroad that's going to move it thinks its a pain in the butt, and therefore weird). Pray for a miracle and a LOT of bucks, folks. The T-motor and S-motor are gonna need BOTH.....
Last edited by H.F.Malone on Mon Sep 26, 2005 8:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

  by rbarcus
Does anyone know how to get in contact with this NRHS chapter? The email contact I have doesn't work.
  by HighlandRail&DEY-7 652
There are plenty of other NYC RS-3's operating here's a list for those who may not know. Adirondack has 1. Mike Fox has 1. Florida Gulf Coast has 1 operating but painted Seaboard. Then DL has the parts one that came off Octoraro. My Suggestion for the 8554 is for someone to take the trucks and the body parts such as the nose and hoods, cab, and whatever mechanical stuff may be usuable and scrap whatever is left. Folks there's 3 running and 2 are repainted NYC it'd probably be best to focus efforts on those ones. Besides the RS-3's nose could be put to use on another RS-3 that may have a shortened nose.

Now for the U 25. Quite rare however there is another NYC example around and at a museum. Perhaps this one should be parted out as well, and the parts distributed to museums who have a need for U-25 parts.

The T and the S should both be saved. For now I would say send them to an organization that may be close by. However indoor storage at some point would be nice too.

  by GN 599
A U25 has 26 air and alignment control couplers, rollerbearings obviously so it wouldnt a tough sell for the Class 1's to move it. I met a UP z train that had an Amtrak SW about 40 cars back, it could be moved like a box car. I've got a line on a FDL and a 567. If it comes down to being scrapped I will place a bid on the unit as long as it is intact. On the other hand I am lazy and can probably find something closer to home for less hassle. But heck a U25 is a rare bird and everybody likes an RS3 :wink: . I could put the U25 to work. I guess all we can do right now is stay up on the subject and hope for the best. I think our hobby has lost too many historic locomotives and these ones were once so-so but now are rare I dont think these ones should be lost too. Were not gonna take it! :-D

  by Paul
The NYC U-boat has a frozen (rusted) engine-- it didn't bar over when tried, five years ago.
An engine that has been sitting for twenty years may not bar over. I hope you pre-lubed the engine before attempting to bar it over, otherwise you are waisting your time and may cause further engine damage. I do believe the U-25 in question is the first production U-25 or Central's first.
I have first hand expieriance on Mike Fox's 8255. We had to replace the entire nose on the long hood, and IIRC the 8254's nose had the same affliction: the corners on the top were cut off and replaced with flat plate steel. Although purely cosmetic, it is still difficult to repair.
As far as moving a locomotive on "today's" railroad. I submit the following link.
http://railroad.net/forums/viewtopic.ph ... 610b0dd748

  by GN 599
Yeah I know what you mean Paul. I imagine if it wouldnt bar over the turbo is probably froze too. If it didnt get too damaged when it was attempted to start it would be a matter of taking everything apart and putting it back together to solve that problem since rings arent too bad but if the crank and main bearings are the culprit then things will be alot more work and money. I missed the RS32 when it rolled through Keddie with the WP stuff. I read the article about the ''special'' in a magazine. One of the Stockton crews met it on the way down and took a pic of it and is in the crew room. I guess other rails still take notice when something neat comes through. Of all the eqiupment in question though I think the U25 would be the easiest to move since its the most modern. Its too bad that a group that is supposed to be into preserving stuff would let things like that sit without proper storage. Blue plastic tarps arent expensive. Lack of interest I guess. I wish we had stuff like that just laying around out west. Everything out here is spoken for. That RS3 might be tricky to move on live rail. Sounds like the Electrics best bet would be via truck.
  by H.F.Malone
Yes, Paul, I followed your RS-32 saga this past spring with great interest, as we were getting ready to move an RS-3 on a class one about that time. I got to see many internet shots of our loco on the move with a taut handbrake chain, despite our having applied a large decal with specific handbrake operating instructions, right next to the brakewheel.

The first NYC U25 is the 2500, at Northeast, PA (via GE donation), not operational, but kept painted and on display.

Blue tarps are cheap, but have a half-life of about 6 months before they shred and have to be replaced.

The person who did it told me the 2510 was prelubed before the attempt to bar over was made.

  by ATK
Last I saw those locomotives, both the RS-3 and U25B were in rough shape. The RS-3 was missing some brake valves and most of its hood doors on the engineer's side of the unit -- someone's attempt to sandblast and paint them to make the thing look a little more respectable. The 2510 had its air box taken down on both sides of the engine (no idea why they did that) and the rad fan drive shaft was disconnected. Other than that, I believe the locomotive was basically intact. Carbody was in tough shape.

For those of you thinking of moving these things, one more thing to consider -- last I knew, they were sitting on a disconnected piece of track. I am not sure of the status of the switch into the Glenmont power plant, however the group had to move the units north, just off the property on an old track running between the port and the power plant as (IIRC) a contractor had to install (or repair?) a water line running directly through the location where the equipment had previously been sitting. This required them to rip up about a 40 ft section of track. Of course you will have to convince the power plant to allow you to re-lay that track, plus move the equipment across their property to get access to the live CSX main. Did I mention that there's a switch back between where the equipment is sitting and the main track? All of this and no locomotive to move the stuff -- CSX sure as hell isn't going to go in there.

  by GN 599
If you could get them close enough to a mainline switch they could be picked up by a train just like a boxcar. The electrics would be a tough sell though. I just hate the thought of them being scrapped. If they are in a few years people will be saying would of could of should have. The good thing is it isnt too late in the game to save them. Its too often we find out about something being scrapped and people say" gee I wish I would have known about it we could have saved it". I guess I am over optimistic. I wish I were closer to the action I would be fighting tooth and nail to secure a safe future for them. But what do I know I am just a flunkie engineer for BNSF. :(