Ashland & Clementon Trains

Discussion relating to the PRSL

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ajt
Posts: 483
Joined: Tue Mar 16, 2004 11:11 pm

Ashland & Clementon Trains

Post by ajt »

When the Ashland and Clementon commuter runs operated, did the equipment lay-up overnight at Ashland and Clementon, or deadhead out in the am from Camden? I'm thinking the early 60's, after the Hammonton runs had been cut back.

JimBoylan
Posts: 3343
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2004 2:33 pm

Post by JimBoylan »

Hearsay has the Clementon train deadheading to Hammonton.

Vermonter

Clementon Local

Post by Vermonter »

Sorry for this slow reply on my end...as you can tell a few weeks have gone by since checking in. I can speak for the last remaining Clementon Local and its counterpart return trip from Clementon to Camden. These were trains 609 southbound and 610 north, surviving I believe until summer of 1965. I rode the final 609 from Camden to Haddon Heights where I lived at the time.

The final pair of trains between Camden and Ashland were #'s 519 south and 656 north, at least according to my Form 3 timetable effective April 25, 1965 which I have hanging up in my office. At this point in time I am not sure why these two train numbers are not both 500 series. I have other PRSL tables but buried in a box.

Anyway more to the question at hand. Having lived in Haddon Heights I can assure you from my own memory and observation that the Clementon pair of trains deadheaded in each direction. Southbound in the morning and northbound in the evening. I believe it was because there was not suitable storage at Clementon. Though certainly not a high-crime area I am sure there would have been vandalism problems. These deadheads sadly, were not revenue trips. When I asked the question way back then I was told that the company found it cheaper to run them as deadheads rather than revenue.

I believe, but am not 100% certain as to the Ashland pair of trains.

Thank you for bringing up the subject of the Clementon local. Dear to my heart.

Vermonter

Sorry...I forgot one thing!

Post by Vermonter »

I did not make it clear in my previous post that the deadheading I remember was from and to Camden, not Hammonton. Again this was in the 1963 - 1965 era. I couldn't tell you for what took place before that.

JimBoylan
Posts: 3343
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2004 2:33 pm

Clementon deadhead?

Post by JimBoylan »

My comment about deadheading between Clementon and Hammonton was based on overhearing remarks by Tansboro area adult members of the Delaware Valley Short Line trolley museum about 1961.

Don Lee

Post by Don Lee »

The reason that the Clementon Branch train did not lay over in Clementon was the fact that the equipment layed over in Millville and the crews home terminal was Millville.

Train 754 operated from Millville to Camden (Broadway). The crew and equipment deadheaded (ran extra) to Clementon and brought in train 610.
The crew laid over in Camden, on pay, during the day. At night they operated train 609 to Clementon, deadheaded back to Camden and operated train 775 to Millville where the crew went off duty.

PRSL GO 1007 withdrew all 4 trains at 4.00am, Monday, July 19, 1965 and at the same time closed Haddon Heights station for the sale of tickets. It is interesting to note that none of these trains operated on weekends, so even though they were not abolished until Monday morning, their last runs were on Friday, July 16, 1965. This ended passenger serice on the Clementon Branch and reduced Millville service to 2 round trips per weekday.

phltransit

Clementon Local

Post by phltransit »

While it is possible that #754, the morning Millville - Camden train, could have deadheaded to Clementon and then returned as Clementon - Camden train #610, it doesn't seem likely that the evening reverse of this could happen, at least not during the last few years of operation.

In the 1963 to 1965 PRSL timetables, Camden - Millville #775 (the last of the three Millville trains) was scheduled to depart Camden at just past 6:00 pm, about 15 minutes prior to Camden - Clementon #609's arrival in Clementon (between 6:15 and 6:20 pm) so there was no time for the turn around run back to Camden.

Could morning #754/610 have run with a pair of RDCs which then ran seperately in the evening, one as #775 directly back to Millville and the other as #609 to Clementon and then deadheaded all of the way back to Millville? Perhaps someone with an ETT from this period will have the answer.

Chuck

JimBoylan
Posts: 3343
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2004 2:33 pm

Post by JimBoylan »

Employees' Timetable 7-D, 10/29/61 agrees with the above post about 609 missing a connection with 775. Neither it nor 8 (4/28/63) nor 10 (4/25/65) show schedules for dead head moves.

Vermonter

Train #610

Post by Vermonter »

To Phltransit -
In reference to your question on whether Train #610 ran with 2 cars the answer is "No", but then again this answer would apply at least to the two final years of service. I could not speak authoritatively before that. I often watched (and rode) #'s 610 and 609 as much as possible but during this period of time I never saw more than one coach on it. Incidentally, a one-way between Camden and Haddon Heights was $.42.

Just as a further addition, not related to your question / comment at all, there were occasions on summer Fridays mainly, when RDC equipment was not used. This was indeed the case on the very last run of #609. One conventional tuscan red coach (P70?) was locomotive-hauled. I think this was because there was a demand for every last RDC heading for the shore on OC/W/CM service. Most likely those who rode that coach were not the most happy campers though because it had low-back seats, not the high-backs customarily used on service all the way to the seashore. Ahhh the memories of this service. I groan when I hear somebody write on these threads that they never experienced it themselves.

Every time I ever rode was an absolute thrill. All the time while on board it would consume me how and why the people of New Jersey were largely content to just let this go by. A question that has haunted me for years.

Bill

mitch kennedy
Posts: 117
Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2006 8:45 pm
Location: Lewiston Maine

clementon trains

Post by mitch kennedy »

I love having a mystery solved! I lived a block from the crossing at Lincoln Ave in Magnolia, and I remember in the summers seeing two RDC runs the way Don Lee described it... I remember after the run was discontinued (I was almost 10) ..what a bummer it was to not see the RDC glide thru town compared to the blasting of the Baldwins on OC90/91! In fact, it was these runs that caused my Dad to break down and buy me an Athearn RDC from the old hobby shop in the Cherry Hill Mall--B&O and dummy to boot, but it was great! Needless to say I bought TWO Proto's in PRSL when they came out--it only took about 27 years after the PRSL's demise to have them come out! At least Uncle Tony still keeps the flame burning down at Tuckahoe (the Lenni word for "ceaseless mosquitoes" or possibly "missed connection"...) Love these discussions---Thanks to the likes of Mr Lee , Steam Man and Vermonter
Thanks!

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