bankruptcy and mergers

Discussion relating to the Penn Central, up until its 1976 inclusion in Conrail. Visit the Penn Central Railroad Historical Society for more information.

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bluegrass-express

bankruptcy and mergers

Post by bluegrass-express » Wed Feb 18, 2009 5:59 pm

It struck me recently as I listened to news of huge, bankrupt, modern-day corporations proposing mergers to deal with their financial problems: where have I/we heard this before? And what have we learned?
Maybe Penn Central would still be around if our government tossed it billions instead of mere millions. :wink:

lvrr325
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Re: bankruptcy and mergers

Post by lvrr325 » Wed Feb 18, 2009 9:19 pm

Technically it is still around, whatever name the company goes by now.

Noel Weaver
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Re: bankruptcy and mergers

Post by Noel Weaver » Thu Feb 19, 2009 4:59 am

bluegrass-express wrote:It struck me recently as I listened to news of huge, bankrupt, modern-day corporations proposing mergers to deal with their financial problems: where have I/we heard this before? And what have we learned?
Maybe Penn Central would still be around if our government tossed it billions instead of mere millions. :wink:
One reason the Penn Central failed was because it was mis-managed as badly as any corporation could possibly be. Giving or
loaning them money would have just continued the failed process.
I suggest you try to find a copy of the book "Wreck of the Penn Central", this interesting book goes into the "nuts and bolts"
of the railroad and the mis-management of the late 60's and early and mid 70's.
Noel Weaver

bluegrass-express

Re: bankruptcy and mergers

Post by bluegrass-express » Thu Feb 19, 2009 10:04 am

Noel Weaver wrote:...
One reason the Penn Central failed was because it was mis-managed as badly as any corporation could possibly be. Giving or
loaning them money would have just continued the failed process.
...
Noel Weaver
I remember. My original point was that the federal government and/or contemporary mega-corporations don't seem to remember. As I listen to news, market reports, and documentaries (one last night on public TV), it looks like it's going to happen again: banks, auto industry, satellite radio... How does it go? When you don't pay attention to history, your doomed to repeat it?

That was sarcasm that didn't shine through (as usual in this medium). It's funny that the feds cried about propping up railroads with millions, but today they don't seem to blink at tossing around billions.

Noel Weaver
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Re: bankruptcy and mergers

Post by Noel Weaver » Thu Feb 19, 2009 10:50 am

bluegrass-express wrote:
Noel Weaver wrote:...
One reason the Penn Central failed was because it was mis-managed as badly as any corporation could possibly be. Giving or
loaning them money would have just continued the failed process.
...
Noel Weaver
I remember. My original point was that the federal government and/or contemporary mega-corporations don't seem to remember. As I listen to news, market reports, and documentaries (one last night on public TV), it looks like it's going to happen again: banks, auto industry, satellite radio... How does it go? When you don't pay attention to history, your doomed to repeat it?

That was sarcasm that didn't shine through (as usual in this medium). It's funny that the feds cried about propping up railroads with millions, but today they don't seem to blink at tossing around billions.
I was simply trying to be helpful in answering your question.
It looks to me like you are trying to steer this to a discussion about politics which DOES NOT BELONG ON HERE.
Noel Weaver

bluegrass-express

Re: bankruptcy and mergers

Post by bluegrass-express » Wed Feb 25, 2009 12:36 pm

Noel Weaver wrote: I was simply trying to be helpful in answering your question.
It looks to me like you are trying to steer this to a discussion about politics which DOES NOT BELONG ON HERE.
Noel Weaver
I appreciate your comments. I think I understand why Penn Central failed. There's a huge thread going on about that.

I don't care much for politics, but I care a lot about history, railroads, and my own future. I reviewed the rules on this forum and didn't find anything prohibiting discussion of politics. It would make it tough to discuss Penn Central, Conrail, Amtrak, and a host of city and regional transportation agencies, wouldn't it? What I did find was a rule against trying to moderate, if you're not a moderator. If the Penn Central forum moderator found I made inaccurate or offensive comments, I'm sure this thread would be deleted, or he would have notified me.

Most of my posts here on railroad.net have been to illustrate a thread with photos from my collection. Often others have answered with their own opinions or comments about non-railroad stuff. "Bankruptcy and mergers" was my own little statement of opinion, after an "aha" moment listening to the news. While other threads go on examining why railroad corporations failed decades ago, I'm just saying that our corporate culture is doing the Penn Central thing again today: merging with or absorbing a bankrupt/failed corporation. It just boggles my mind hearing the numbers tossed around as it all goes down.

Living in New York State, I can see an interstate highway running parallel to every railroad mainline. Over the past few decades, I've watched customers withdraw from rail service until there is but a skeleton left. I have corresponded with a European railfan and visited Europe once. I know the rest of the world looks in amazement at how our government regards railroads in the grand scheme of transportation. How do things look in Florida?

atsf sp
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Re: bankruptcy and mergers

Post by atsf sp » Thu Mar 05, 2009 8:31 pm

Noel Weaver wrote:
bluegrass-express wrote:It struck me recently as I listened to news of huge, bankrupt, modern-day corporations proposing mergers to deal with their financial problems: where have I/we heard this before? And what have we learned?
Maybe Penn Central would still be around if our government tossed it billions instead of mere millions. :wink:
One reason the Penn Central failed was because it was mis-managed as badly as any corporation could possibly be. Giving or
loaning them money would have just continued the failed process.
I suggest you try to find a copy of the book "Wreck of the Penn Central", this interesting book goes into the "nuts and bolts"
of the railroad and the mis-management of the late 60's and early and mid 70's.
Noel Weaver
Or get the book The Men Who Loved Trains. Starts at the formation of the PC, the fall of the PC, making of CR, buyout of CR. Very interesting and in depth.
"Why would you take a train to go see another train?"
Some people just don't understand.
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Otto Vondrak
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Re: bankruptcy and mergers

Post by Otto Vondrak » Tue Mar 24, 2009 10:02 am

"The Railroad Mergers and the Coming of Conrail" is another good book.

Did you have a specific question regarding Penn Central's bankruptcy? We're not much for politics on these forums...

-otto-
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