Hudson Line third track at Marble Hill?

[Homo sapiens]

With the Harlem third track project slowly approaching completion, I've wondered if there is a need for an extra track on the short 2-track Hudson Line section in the rock cut between Marble Hill and Spuyten Duyvil (CP10 and CP11), or has there been planning for one? Tough rock it is, but less than 1/2 a mile long, the easiest way through would be to level the ledge on the Harlem River side and use the spoil as on-site fill. Hopefully, this wouldn't adversely impact any striped bass.
I do realize that the glory days of NYC passenger trains are long since past, and that Amtrak has been (except for detours) gone from the cut since 1991. So I emphasize, is there a need *for Metro-North* to have no fewer than 3 tracks between Mott Haven Jct. and Spuyten Duyvil?

HS

[DutchRailnut]

The area has landmark status and can not be alterred, so no third or more tracks.
In my eyes a straight new track from Marble hill should tunnel right under the apartment buildings forgo Spuyten duyvil station but put a new fourtrack underground station smack in middle of town, make CP12 further north and have this 4 track tunnel exit near Riverdale. shoot every one else is dreaming, maybe we could use those tunnel machines for ESA a bit longer.

[Homo sapiens]

The area has landmark status and can not be alterred, so no third or more tracks.

Bummer. What kind of landmark, natural like the Palisades, or some other type like historical? State, city or both?

In my eyes a straight new track from Marble hill should tunnel right under the apartment buildings forgo Spuyten duyvil station but put a new fourtrack underground station smack in middle of town, make CP12 further north and have this 4 track tunnel exit near Riverdale. shoot every one else is dreaming, maybe we could use those tunnel machines for ESA a bit longer.

Sounds good to me.

[Sean W.]

[quote="DutchRailnut"]The area has landmark status and can not be alterred, so no third or more tracks.
[quote]

So, if the area bacame a massive bottleneck - nothing - no dice? I would have though that using infill on the river to provide extra space, that wouldn't be OK either?

That bites. I think the best solution would be to shorten the blocks, if that were needed, to allow trains to come through at higher rates.

I've heard of such a problem at the East River Tunbnels into Penn, they're congested like crazy, hence no MN - NHL access to Penn. They have four tracks to serve Amtrak LIRR and NJT. The blocks really need to be shortened there.

There is one thing that never made sense to me about some heavy railroads. That is that while buses and cars on roads can move in tight succession, a short piece of track can lie idle for most of its time. The execptions are light rail systems. Take many systems in Europe, and in particular the Luas in Dublin, Ireland. Those trams will be moving at relatively high speed with a technical limit of an 80 second headway. I believe that shortening headways is a smarter answer - where it is practical so to do.

[Tony Tantillo]

Here are the links to a couple of photos at http://www.nycsubway.org. Not only 4 tracks at Marble Hill, but low platforms.!

http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?20203

http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?20216

[DutchRailnut]

Correct the area were those pictures were taken are south of current marble hill, the 2 track section is north of marble hill and has always been 2 tracks. were the pictures are taken its currently 3 tracks because of the high level island platforms were track 1 use to be.

[Mike Roque]

Bummer. What kind of landmark, natural like the Palisades, or some other type like historical? State, city or both?

That rock is known as "The C Rock". Years ago (I don't know when), a big C was painted on the side facing the river for Columbia University that is just across the water. You can take a look from the park on the Manhattan side near the field.

[Tony Tantillo]

Correct the area were those pictures were taken are south of current marble hill, the 2 track section is north of marble hill and has always been 2 tracks. were the pictures are taken its currently 3 tracks because of the high level island platforms were track 1 use to be.

So even in the NYC heyday the four tracks of Marble Hill were of minimal usage for passing.

[DutchRailnut]

In NYC times the tracks from Spuyten Duyvil bridge to MO were frequented by lots of freights, going up Harlem and transfer runs to Oak point.
These days only commuter trains and 16 weekly freight trains traverse the Spuyten Duyvil Cut and those only travel at night after evening rush, but defenitly not warranting a 4th track