Major grade-crossing accident in Valhalla 2/3/15

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Gilbert B Norman
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Re: Major grade-crossing accident in Valhalla 2/3/15

Post by Gilbert B Norman » Wed Feb 04, 2015 2:38 pm

Ken S wrote:The incident on Metrolink being referred to was the 2005 Glendale Crash where a train with the cab car leading struck a Jeep on the tracks and caused a chain reaction crash with two other trains.
While I cannot directly speak for Mr. Boylan, in all likelihood the subject incident at Chatsworth was when during 2008, an outside contractor Engineer for the LAMTA operating an NB train had a collision with an SB UP freight. It was determined that the LAMTA contract Engineer had been texting with a railfan friend at that time.

MACTRAXX
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Re: Major grade-crossing accident in Valhalla 2/3/15

Post by MACTRAXX » Wed Feb 04, 2015 2:44 pm

Ken S. wrote:
JimBoylan wrote:TAN Chatsworth, Calif. reaction
The Metrolink train at Chatsworth in 2008 had a Diesel locomotive leading. After the crash, it was found telescoped inside the 1st passenger car that it had been pulling.
There have been fires after Diesel train accidents that were not at grade crossings, or in 3rd rail territory.
The incident on Metrolink being referred to was the 2005 Glendale Crash where a train with the cab car leading struck a Jeep on the tracks and caused a chain reaction crash with two other trains.
Ken and Everyone -

January 26,2005 was the date of this Metrolink crash in Glendale,CA - see:
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005_Gle ... rain_crash" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This accident amazed me that a vehicle on the track could cause this much damage and there are
similarities to the Valhalla tragedy...

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Last edited by MACTRAXX on Wed Feb 04, 2015 3:16 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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jackintosh11
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Re: Major grade-crossing accident in Valhalla 2/3/15

Post by jackintosh11 » Wed Feb 04, 2015 2:46 pm

Ridgefielder wrote:
nomis wrote:hird rail public grade crossings happen, off the top of my head, only on a couple systems here: MN, LIRR, Chicago CTA.
No grade crossings on the ex-Philadelphia & Western trackage operated by SEPTA?
Nope.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXu4mb ... 8cuxblPB9g Videos, including SEPTA time lapses.

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Tommy Meehan
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Re: Major grade-crossing accident in Valhalla 2/3/15

Post by Tommy Meehan » Wed Feb 04, 2015 2:51 pm

Jeff Smith wrote:I agree that crossing should be closed permanently. There's a bridge over the RR just a bit north of the station. Put another ped bridge over the whole parkway too, and close parkway access there, too.
Being from the area I'm not sure it would be possible to permanently close Commerce Street where it crosses the tracks. It's fairly heavily used as a connector between (ironically) the Westchester Medical Center area and the towns of Hawthorne and Thornwood. It should definitely receive some safety enhancements as well as some of the other Harlem Line grade crossings. Virginia Road in North White Plains is another one where traffic backs up at rush hour with cars sitting within the railroad right-of-way and where there have been many near misses.

Btw I think the former electrified Reading lines in the Philadelphia area have grade crossings. I don't think the former P&W lines do.

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Re: Major grade-crossing accident in Valhalla 2/3/15

Post by Ken W2KB » Wed Feb 04, 2015 3:11 pm

jackintosh11 wrote:What about installing a device like a dragging equipment detector to shut off the third rail if it detects something like this?
The power protection system relay would detect the fault (short to ground) and trip the breakers. Nothing can be done to prevent the initial flashover.
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Tommy Meehan
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Re: Major grade-crossing accident in Valhalla 2/3/15

Post by Tommy Meehan » Wed Feb 04, 2015 3:28 pm

Regarding electric passenger lines with grade crossings, I haven't been out that way in a while, but there used to be at least one on the Morristown Line at Denville. A couple on the Gladstone Branch. The New Canaan Branch had one too near Talmadge Hill. And of course as has been mentioned, quite a few on LIRR.

Regarding the grade crossings, would some PTC systems have the capability to 'sense' a vehicle fouling a crossing when a train is approaching?

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Re: Major grade-crossing accident in Valhalla 2/3/15

Post by R36 Combine Coach » Wed Feb 04, 2015 3:42 pm

Tommy Meehan wrote:Regarding electric passenger lines with grade crossings, I haven't been out that way in a while, but there used to be at least one on the Morristown Line at Denville. A couple on the Gladstone Branch. The New Canaan Branch had one too near Talmadge Hill. And of course as has been mentioned, quite a few on LIRR.
All are overhead wire, except the Upper Harlem Line, LIRR and CTA.

LIRR is rather abundant with third rail crossings, on all electric lines except the South Shore and even one in LIC, between LIC and Hunterspoint. CTA has crossings on the Ravenswood (Brown), Evanston (Purple), Skokie (Yellow), and Cermak (Pink) branches.
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Re: Major grade-crossing accident in Valhalla 2/3/15

Post by jackintosh11 » Wed Feb 04, 2015 3:52 pm

Ken W2KB wrote:
jackintosh11 wrote:What about installing a device like a dragging equipment detector to shut off the third rail if it detects something like this?
The power protection system relay would detect the fault (short to ground) and trip the breakers. Nothing can be done to prevent the initial flashover.
Are you sure, because there are a lot of videos and photos online showing the cars burning and the rear cars still have lights on.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXu4mb ... 8cuxblPB9g Videos, including SEPTA time lapses.

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Re: Major grade-crossing accident in Valhalla 2/3/15

Post by F-line to Dudley via Park » Wed Feb 04, 2015 4:00 pm

R36 Combine Coach wrote:
Tommy Meehan wrote:Regarding electric passenger lines with grade crossings, I haven't been out that way in a while, but there used to be at least one on the Morristown Line at Denville. A couple on the Gladstone Branch. The New Canaan Branch had one too near Talmadge Hill. And of course as has been mentioned, quite a few on LIRR.
All are overhead wire, except the Upper Harlem Line, LIRR and CTA.

LIRR is rather abundant with third rail crossings, on all electric lines except the South Shore and even one in LIC, between LIC and Hunterspoint. CTA has crossings on the Ravenswood (Brown), Evanston (Purple), Skokie (Yellow), and Cermak (Pink) branches.
LIRR's going to have a net increase of +8 third rail crossings when the Central Branch gets electrified. Not even whacking the 7 on the Main out to Hicksville is going to stop it from creeping up. An Atlantic Branch train, a non- Central Branch Babylon train, and a Hudson Line train are the only 3 end-to-end rides you can take in third rail commuter rail territory that have full grade separation. It's a fact of life. One accident's not going to change that.

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Re: Major grade-crossing accident in Valhalla 2/3/15

Post by runningwithscalpels » Wed Feb 04, 2015 4:45 pm

jackintosh11 wrote:
Ken W2KB wrote:
jackintosh11 wrote:What about installing a device like a dragging equipment detector to shut off the third rail if it detects something like this?
The power protection system relay would detect the fault (short to ground) and trip the breakers. Nothing can be done to prevent the initial flashover.
Are you sure, because there are a lot of videos and photos online showing the cars burning and the rear cars still have lights on.
Batteries.

Power was cut to the M8's in Bridgeport and the marker lights stayed on for quite some time.
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Re: Major grade-crossing accident in Valhalla 2/3/15

Post by MACTRAXX » Wed Feb 04, 2015 4:47 pm

Everyone:

The MNCR Valhalla tragedy reminded me of a similar accident that occurred on Tuesday January 22, 2013
on the LIRR at Brentwood - in this case a vehicle with two occupants drove around lowered gates just west
of the station and were struck by a eastbound M3 deadhead train destined for the Ronkonkoma Yard...

After the vehicle was hit the train - which was moving at or near MAS - came to a stop in the station and
the vehicle's gasoline fueled a fire that burned up the front end of car 9870 and to this day some scorched ties
are still visible on the westbound track just to the west of the Brentwood waiting room...

Thankfully that train carried no passengers and the Engineer escaped without serious injury...

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Last edited by MACTRAXX on Wed Feb 04, 2015 5:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Major grade-crossing accident in Valhalla 2/3/15

Post by Ridgefielder » Wed Feb 04, 2015 4:57 pm

Tommy Meehan wrote:The New Canaan Branch had one too near Talmadge Hill.
New Canaan branch has something like 10. About the only roads it *doesn't* cross at grade are the Merritt Parkway and Old Stamford Rd./CT 106.

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Re: Major grade-crossing accident in Valhalla 2/3/15

Post by runningwithscalpels » Wed Feb 04, 2015 5:08 pm

Mactraxx, that's exactly what I first thought of when I heard about this too. I couldn't remember when that had happened though.
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Re: Major grade-crossing accident in Valhalla 2/3/15

Post by 4400Washboard » Wed Feb 04, 2015 5:19 pm

What will happen to the mate of the first car? Considering that it's mate is heavily damaged, I'd expect it'd be used for parts like the R143s from the L line bumper block collision (NYC Subway accident)
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Re: Major grade-crossing accident in Valhalla 2/3/15

Post by carajul » Wed Feb 04, 2015 5:24 pm

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