MNRR West of Hudson (WoH) Study - Stewart Airport

Discussion relating to the operations of MTA MetroNorth Railroad including west of Hudson operations and discussion of CtDOT sponsored rail operations such as Shore Line East and the Springfield to New Haven Hartford Line

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Irish Chieftain

Post by Irish Chieftain » Wed Nov 08, 2006 8:55 pm

This thread ain't about the Tappan Zee rail link proposal per se—it's about linking the Port Jervis Line to Stewart Airport. I mentioned the Tappan Zee link in the context of the only case where NJT would not be operating a train to Stewart Airport. Under the status quo, NJ Transit would be operating all trains to/from Stewart Airport.

As far as the Tappan Zee proposal goes, it's still in limbo. It was originally supposed to be part of the new highway bridge, but apparently nobody knew what exactly to do with it. If it were to be linked with the Piermont Branch (only way it could do this is if the rail line follows I-87 to Nanuet, where the PVL crosses that highway), Metro-North could operate dual-mode diesel trains between GCT and Port Jervis—not electrified, since the cost of third-rail electrification can be rather high and would require building high platforms en-masse to accommodate Metro-North's MU fleet whose doors are strictly for high platforms (Metro-North's Shoreliner push-pulls have steps and trapdoors). NJT, in such a case, would still operate Hoboken-Suffern as most Main-Bergen trains do.

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Post by Noel Weaver » Thu Nov 09, 2006 12:44 am

You are taking much for granted.
Further, the subject of NYS&W/Delaware Otsego does NOT belong on here.
Noel Weaver

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Post by Jeff Smith » Thu Nov 09, 2006 12:58 pm

Stewart Airport has a lot of growth potential that has never been realized. Too far from Albany, and too far from Westchester/Rockland. Maybe with new Airtran svc and a rail-link? Still, I think potential is low for ridership. Better to construct the Suffern - Port Chester link.
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Otto Vondrak
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Post by Otto Vondrak » Thu Nov 09, 2006 2:56 pm

Where did you hear that this was one of his plans? Cite the source, if you can.

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SecaucusJunction
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Post by SecaucusJunction » Fri Nov 10, 2006 1:51 pm

How would this link work? Would there be some sort of monorail type thing connecting the airport to the tracks which seem to be just under a mile away? Or would they run the train straight to the airport. Its a great idea, in theory, if the airport becomes much larger like they have it planned. It just seems that there would have to be increased service, which means improvements in infrastructure on lines connecting to the airport.....

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Post by cpontani » Fri Nov 10, 2006 2:34 pm

I read somewhere (I forgot where) that they'd be running (something) right into the airport. But would they run the NJT train right into Stweart, with a MN shuttle to Port Jervis? There's a lot of things about this scheme that sounded like classic New York short-sightedness. On Long Island, the Ronkonkoma station is on the north side of Islip Airport, yet there has been little if no attempt to promote the connection from the LIRR to the airport terminal. You would tink Southwest would want to call it an alternative to NYC, like they call PVD and MHT Boston, and they're in different states after all.

Bringing it back, I think Stewart is too far away using contemporary heavy rail to cover the distance in a short period of time to convince people to fly Jet Blue out of there instead of JFK. And the cost of Maglev or something like that would be prohibitive. They're just looking for a regional airport to expand and bring in a nice piece of business, not create the next JFK there.

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Post by SecaucusJunction » Fri Nov 10, 2006 4:43 pm

If people find lower fares at Stewart Airport, they will travel there. I couldnt count the amount of times I've driven to JFK to get a cheaper fare. If people can take the train there, its all the better. I doubt it will ever be another JFK airport, but it could serve a lot of the spillover and make congestion less in the NYC area...

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Post by Erie-Lackawanna » Fri Nov 10, 2006 7:00 pm

I live in Queens, walking distance from an LIRR station, and I'll tell you right now that even if they instituted direct service from Jamaica to EWR, I wouldn't go to EWR. It's too far, regardless of any difference in air fare. So to get New Yorkers to go 1.5 hours on a train to Stewart is a pipe dream. If you'd do it, I say, enjoy the first-class service with the other three people who would join you. ;-)

Meanwhile, I'll moan and groan LOUDLY if it looks like my tax dollars might be wasted on something like this.

Those of you who live within a convenient drive of Stewart should use it and enjoy it. But don't waste my money on a stupid plan to entice city residents to use it.

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Post by NJTRailfan » Fri Nov 10, 2006 8:00 pm

Stewart is beign groomed for the next JFK/LGA/EWR. clearly there is very little room left for air traffic/expansion of terminals. So places like Albany, Stewart, Mac Aurthur would like airlines like Southwest, Air Tran, Allegiant even the express cariers of legacy airlines to fly there if not the big international carriers. Main Line carriers may not be intrested now but wait until 10 or even 20 yrs from now when they need to go elsewhere due to slto restrictions like LGA or they run out of room. Look at Jet Blue Southwest and Air Tran expanding service all over upstate NY. Even Allentown, Trenton and AC are doing the same. Maybe even the international carriers could join up since some of these airports can handle larger aircrafts like a 747, 767, 777.
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Otto Vondrak
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Post by Otto Vondrak » Fri Nov 10, 2006 8:06 pm

They will build a branch to Stewart right after they dust off the plans for the old Westchester Northern and build a branch from White Plains to Westchester County Airport in Purchase...

It's not needed, it's sunshine-pumping by local politicians who want their slice of the transportation pie. If it were so sorely needed, it would have been done years ago...

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Post by MickD » Sat Nov 11, 2006 8:30 am

It might not be at the forefront, but I can see where it might be realized during his tenure given that he has suggested the need for a fourth airport. I've been up that way a lot through the years, but never inside Stewart itself. How easy would it be to run a rail link directly into the terminal? If it's a relatively simple configuration, it might be truly viable alternative for the surrounding NY State counties with their continually growing populations and Northern NJ, considering the transfers involved with traveling by rail to either JFK or EWR. It could even be a serious alternative to driving in the long run.
Last edited by MickD on Tue Nov 14, 2006 6:07 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Post by SecaucusJunction » Mon Nov 13, 2006 11:32 am

There are very few people I know who wont somehow get someone to drive them to JFK airport from NJ if they can get a cheaper fare than Newark. The ride to Stewart might be longer in miles, but it will be far more pleasant than driving to JFK. Given the choice between the two, I'd drive to Newburgh

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Post by cpontani » Mon Nov 13, 2006 1:00 pm

SecaucusJunction wrote:There are very few people I know who wont somehow get someone to drive them to JFK airport from NJ if they can get a cheaper fare than Newark. The ride to Stewart might be longer in miles, but it will be far more pleasant than driving to JFK. Given the choice between the two, I'd drive to Newburgh
...from Jersey. I agree. If I were in North Jersey, and had the option of saving a ton of money driving an hour or so north, I'd do it. But I'd be hard pressed to cross the GWB, or any of the lower Hudson River crossings.

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Post by CComMack » Tue Nov 14, 2006 4:48 am

What's the fastest a train could run to Stewart Airport, assuming no unplanned major track upgrades and a branded airport express service running from Hoboken and only calling at Secaucus and Suffern on the way? What's the current fare to the nearest existing station? These are questions that should be answered before mooting about the viability of a rail-connected Stewart as the fourth NYC airport.

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