Rail Diesel Cars

Discussion of the past and present operations of the Long Island Rail Road.

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DutchRailnut
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Re: Rail Diesel Cars

Post by DutchRailnut »

452 Card wrote:"SPV" def.= Seldom Powered Vehicle

really ??? rethoric from LIRR, now there is new one.
If Conductors are in charge, why are they promoted to be Engineer???

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Noel Weaver
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Re: Rail Diesel Cars

Post by Noel Weaver »

I ran Budd RDC's many times on both the Harlem and the New Haven and believe me, there was nothing slow about them. They would outrun standard equipment in nearly every situation. They were fast out of stations in almost every case, the only case where there were performance issues would be in cases of slippery rail generally in the fall with leaves. The RDC's outperformed the SPV's in just about every respect at least in my opinion. I rode them many times too on the PRSL, in Canada and on the New Haven when they went like a bat out of hell as well. Incidentally with regard to disconnecting one axle on each truck, this was an issue brought up by the UTU in behalf of the firemen, sad part of this was that it was only a very short later that the UTU gave up on firemen in passenger service on Conrail in Metro-North territory even before Metro-North took over.
Noel Weaver

keyboardkat
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Re: Rail Diesel Cars

Post by keyboardkat »

I thought the RDCs had two-speed torque converters. And I thought that, as built, only the inboard axle on each truck was powered. Is this not so?

I rode the LIRR's two RDCs on two fantrips in around 1959 and 1960. One went LIC-Greenport-Mineola-Oyster Bay-MIneola, then down the Garden City Secondary (flagging each crossing) on to the old Central line. Then the crew changed ends and it was back to Jamaica via the Hempstead branch. The other one went Jamaica-LIC via the Main Line, then back to Jamaica via the Montauk Branch, then down to the south shore via the Montauk Viaduct and the Montauk Branch, and out to Montauk, with the return trip via the Central Branch and the Main Line. On the Greenport trip, I remember they went like a bat out of hell. Running westbound through the North Fork, I was standing at the railing by the open baggage door and we barreled through Laurel (which was a very short platform with no facilities) at what MUST have been far above the MAS, raising a whirlwind of dust and papers and junk behind us. It was a Sunday evening and there was no other traffic on the line at that time. There was apparently a tour train parked at Greenport station on the layup track, with an RS-3 (shut down) and about eight P-72s. I remember on the Greenport trip outbound, we passed a Central Islip Hospital train parked on a siding at Ronkonkoma after discharging passengers. It had an F-M C-liner and a mixture of P-72s and American Flyer cars. We had seen that train depart Jamaica before boarding the RDCs at the start of the trip. I was in the 9th grade at the time.

My understanding is, when the NH and B&M standardized their Boston commuter service with RDCs, operating costs were cut in half. The B&O used RDCs for their Daylight Speedliners. They equipped them with reclining seats, and the first car, a sort of modified RDC-2 (baggage-coach), had a small dinette and food service. An RDC sleeping car service was talked about, but never materialized. This equipment, I think, never realized its potential. RDCs could have taken over all off-peak service on the LIRR in diesel territory, requiring fewer locomotives and unpowered cars just to handle the rush hour overflow.
Fairbanks-Morse forever!

Cannon Ball
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Re: Rail Diesel Cars

Post by Cannon Ball »

We know the RDC-1 was scrapped, but the last I heard (maybe 2 years ago), the RDC-2 was stored out of service at MARC, the Maryland commuter line into Washington, DC. The baggage section had been converted into a handicapped area, with the larger side doors providing wheelchair access, and the open area fitted out with wheelchair tiedown points. Anybody have an update, or seen it lately?

Since MARC is a government entity, they probably have hoops to jump through to be able to sell a capital asset like this car - but - one of Long Island's railroad historical societies ought to have a fair shot at getting it donated, since as a 501(c)3 organization, they step ahead of any other non-government entity in acquisition of surplus assets from a government entity.

The car ought to be a fairly easy restoration - certainly much easier, faster, and cheaper than a G5 or an RS-3, and such a restoration would provide both motive power AND passenger-carrying capacity all in one unit. Could even pull a Ping for short distances at low speeds, huh? How 'bout it, guys at RMLI or OBRM or...???

DutchRailnut
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Re: Rail Diesel Cars

Post by DutchRailnut »

keyboardkat wrote:I thought the RDCs had two-speed torque converters. And I thought that, as built, only the inboard axle on each truck was powered. Is this not so?

My understanding is, when the NH and B&M standardized their Boston commuter service with RDCs, operating costs were cut in half. The B&O used RDCs for their Daylight Speedliners. They equipped them with reclining seats, and the first car, a sort of modified RDC-2 (baggage-coach), had a small dinette and food service. An RDC sleeping car service was talked about, but never materialized. This equipment, I think, never realized its potential. RDCs could have taken over all off-peak service on the LIRR in diesel territory, requiring fewer locomotives and unpowered cars just to handle the rush hour overflow.
the RDC had a single speed orq converter, the clunk at 15 mph was the lockup of slip system.

yes the RDC only had the inboard axles powered, the SPV originaly had all axles powered but later inboard only.

The two lead RDC's in B&O speedliner service, were not modified but only two purpose build RDC diners, one is at B&O museum other is in Gagliardi RDC foundation at Hobo railroad in New Hampshire.
If Conductors are in charge, why are they promoted to be Engineer???

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hondajohn
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Re: Rail Diesel Cars

Post by hondajohn »

Reopening an old topic to partially answer Cannonball's question.

- LIRR #3121 was traded to the B&O in July 1968 for the Observation Car "Napannee".

- It operated on the B&O under three different road numbers: initially #1972, then later to #9921 and again to #9931 by 1970. In July 1980, it was sold to MARC. Notice that the ghost of the "Dashing Dan" logo is still visible in the B&O photo.

- The car was rebuilt by General Electric in 1982 and renumbered to #9821. It was wrecked in a runaway at Camden Station on November 19, 1982. The accident appears to have partially crushed the baggage-end vestibule and part of the baggage/handicap accessible area. It was "retired" in 1982 and last photographed at the MARC Locust Point Yard in April 1984. Current disposition is unknown.
lirr3121MPkNov60.jpg
BO RDC-780629 Tr40 Gaithersburg, MD.jpg
9821.jpg
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newkirk
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Re: Rail Diesel Cars

Post by newkirk »

Thank you hondajohn

Any background on the history and disposition of the other RDC ?
Bill Mangahas (AKA Newkirk Images LLC)
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ConstanceR46
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Re: Rail Diesel Cars

Post by ConstanceR46 »

Oh yeah - it sideswiped a truck, unfortunately killing the engineer. It languished in corona, but was cut up around the early 70s.
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RGlueck
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Re: Rail Diesel Cars

Post by RGlueck »

While the wrecked RDC remained at Morris Park, it sat alongside the old "Jamaica", which is now a display piece. At the time there was talk of taking off the observation end of the "Jamaica" and splicing it onto the wrecked end of the Budd car. It would be used for inspections. That fell through and the Budd was scrapped.

nyandw
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Re: Rail Diesel Cars

Post by nyandw »

ConstanceR46 wrote:
Thu Nov 21, 2019 7:48 pm
Oh yeah - it sideswiped a truck, unfortunately killing the engineer. It languished in corona, but was cut up around the early 70s.
Engineer “Patsy” Molese and the Budd Car by Dave Keller
http://www.trainsarefun.com/lirrphotos/ ... gnette.htm

LIRR RDC #3101 Wrecked 1967, sold in 12/71 to Sarnelli Brothers and scrapped at the LIRR’s Corona Yard.
Info: Dave Keller 06/2004
Image

lumpum
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Re: Rail Diesel Cars

Post by lumpum »

I have the original number plate off the 3101 in my garage. My dad (RIP) was part of the scrapping in Corona. Send me an email if your interested in purchasing it. Stainless steel throw me an offer.
C7CDBD71-7ACC-4ADB-8D5D-33E6A8E1B712.jpeg
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nyandw
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RDC's Fan Trip(s)

Post by nyandw »

This photo and similar ones, surface often mislabeled with dates varying from 1954-57 and 1964. From the http://www.trainsarefun.com/lirr/lirrfa ... ntrips.htm Fan Trip November 1, 1964, BUDD RDC North Shore Rail Tour.

The tour of Sunday April 27, 1957 is of interest to document, further. Anyone that can provide the brochure, map, itinerary, passes, etc. would be great so I can document and add to the Fan Trip page: http://www.trainsarefun.com/lirr/lirrfa ... ntrips.htm Thank you for help. :-)
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John_Perkowski
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Re: Rail Diesel Cars

Post by John_Perkowski »

Admin note:

Two topics merged.
~John Perkowski: Moderator: General Discussion: Locomotives, Rolling Stock, and Equipment
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jhdeasy
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Re: Rail Diesel Cars

Post by jhdeasy »

Noel Weaver wrote:
Sun Oct 14, 2012 2:49 pm
I ran Budd RDC's many times on both the Harlem and the New Haven and believe me, there was nothing slow about them. They would outrun standard equipment in nearly every situation.
Although I never rode either of the two RDC's on LIRR, I did ride RDC's in regular revenue service on MTA Penn Central (Hudson and Harlem Lines), SEPTA (former Reading Lines), Conrail NJ Transit (Wall Street or Crusader) and the joint Conrail - TH&B - CP route between Buffalo and Toronto.

Thanks to a friendly engineer, I got to ride a portion of my November 1977 trip from Buffalo to Toronto in the cab of the lead RDC and clearly recall our two or three car train of RDC's making a steady 90 MPH across a good distance of southern Ontario.

I recommend the book "Budd Car, The RDC Story" by Chuck Crouse, to those interested in the RDC.
hondajohn wrote: Reopening an old topic to partially answer Cannonball's question.

- LIRR #3121 was traded to the B&O in July 1968 for the Observation Car "Napannee".
B&O's NAPANNEE became LIRR 2000 AMAGANSETT, later 2000 MORRIS PARK. This car, in very poor overall condition, had been sitting in Romney WV on the South Branch Valley RR for a number of years, after retirement by LIRR circa 1999. A few months ago I was told that it has been acquired by a small shortline (George's Creek Railway) in Westernport MD and Keyser WV.

http://www.dominionrailvoyages.com/jhd/ ... nsett.html

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