Tragic derailment of corridor train

[25Hz]

I just hope it wasn't human error. I'm reminded of a certain Metra train that took a 15mph crossover too fast. The hard part is that the three people who could tell the most are not able to shed any light on anything now....

I've been on many a train on the Oakville Sub that has departed Aldershot on Track 2 and been up to a pretty good speed by the time it reached King Road (on a straight move on Track #2)....

That is my experience as well, the trains tend to accelerate pretty quickly. Whatever the cause is, i too am very curious as to how the loco lost its truck like that. Based on the photos 6444 obviously went through part of that building the one car was under the lower wooden looking roof of. Knowing that, i'm honesty not surprised about the fatalities in the cab. Something went very, very wrong for this all to happen.

[scoostraw]

Man what a horrible tragedy.

In looking at the photos, I have a couple of questions. How far back is the crossover from where the train ended uo?

Does it look to anyone else that part of the train might have picked a switch and been on another track? The locomotive lost both trucks, as if it were "tipped" off of the bolsters. This is speculation of course, but I'm wondering if part of the train picked a switch in crossing over... then the train accelerated as the engine crew was not aware of this - until forces caused the derailment and the locomotive to rotate over.

I will be very interested in the official findings. Do VIA locomotives have "cab-cams" like Amtrak units do?

[buddah]

Condolences to all, A tragedy that can not be undone but can be learned from to prevent this from happening in the future. I've ridden that part of the corridor more times than I can remember and I must say VIA does cross at some pretty high speeds in that location and do so safely every day. The F40 locomotive since it was a rebuild did have the "cab- cam" installed, if it was operational is another story. Not a good day for Via rail as now there down A rebuilt F40 and from the pictures one of the cars was a newly rebuilt LRC car, Im sure VIA was not planning on having that car back in the shop anytime soon. Insured or not it certainly is not a way you want to start off your new/rebuilt fleet equipment. I myself if on board would have been "kissing dirt" as I usually ride VIA 1 and I love to hold the last seat to the right in VIA 1 where the desk is "hostage".

PS: The VULCHERS are already out.... http://www.torontosun.com/2012/02/28/10 ... derailment

[num1hendrickfan]

Man what a horrible tragedy.

In looking at the photos, I have a couple of questions. How far back is the crossover from where the train ended uo?

Does it look to anyone else that part of the train might have picked a switch and been on another track? The locomotive lost both trucks, as if it were "tipped" off of the bolsters. This is speculation of course, but I'm wondering if part of the train picked a switch in crossing over... then the train accelerated as the engine crew was not aware of this - until forces caused the derailment and the locomotive to rotate over.

I will be very interested in the official findings. Do VIA locomotives have "cab-cams" like Amtrak units do?

A picked switch is what I thought based upon the pictures. As for how back the switch is, I'd estimate about 100-500 feet based upon bing maps ( between where the locomotive ended up and to where the switch is located ).

[AEM7AC920]

If the train was suppose to be down to 15 for the crossover my thought is could a wreck be so severe at 15 mph? I'm sure the download will shed some light on what happened but one can't help but wonder.

[Silverliner II]

I found out today from a friend in Ontario that her cousin (a VIA employee) was aboard the rear car of Train 92 that day. She didn't know if she was working that train or just deadheading into Toronto to her run. In any event, aside from bumps and bruises, she was not seriously hurt.

[25Hz]

After viewing additional video and looking again at some photos, it looks like the locomotive sustained quite extensive damage, and may not be salvageable. The carbody is crushed in enough to have contacted the mechanical equipment inside, the roof is buckled, the cab itself is just destroyed, the trucks coming off is very strange, and the fact that one is still on the rails baffles me.

VIA could lease a P42 from amtrak if losing the one locomotive adversely affects operations.

[FCM2829]

Is the Oakville sub a CN or a CP right of way?
Does VIA own any track at all?

[scoostraw]

After viewing additional video and looking again at some photos, it looks like the locomotive sustained quite extensive damage, and may not be salvageable. The carbody is crushed in enough to have contacted the mechanical equipment inside, the roof is buckled, the cab itself is just destroyed, the trucks coming off is very strange, and the fact that one is still on the rails baffles me.

VIA could lease a P42 from amtrak if losing the one locomotive adversely affects operations.

It's almost as if the cars left the rails, tipped - and took the locomotive with them - rotating it off its trucks. It's too bad there isn't a security camera somewhere in the vicinity that might have caught the incident.

[scoostraw]

I found out today from a friend in Ontario that her cousin (a VIA employee) was aboard the rear car of Train 92 that day. She didn't know if she was working that train or just deadheading into Toronto to her run. In any event, aside from bumps and bruises, she was not seriously hurt.

I've read the news reports where passengers were interviewed to try and get an idea of how fast the train was moving. I wonder if her cousin had a feel for the train's speed?

Hopefully the data recorder will nail this down.

[25Hz]

After viewing additional video and looking again at some photos, it looks like the locomotive sustained quite extensive damage, and may not be salvageable. The carbody is crushed in enough to have contacted the mechanical equipment inside, the roof is buckled, the cab itself is just destroyed, the trucks coming off is very strange, and the fact that one is still on the rails baffles me.

VIA could lease a P42 from amtrak if losing the one locomotive adversely affects operations.

It's almost as if the cars left the rails, tipped - and took the locomotive with them - rotating it off its trucks. It's too bad there isn't a security camera somewhere in the vicinity that might have caught the incident.

Something I just noticed: the rear of the last car is still within the switch on the converging side.
http://bdnpull.bangorpublishing.netdna- ... 00x413.jpg

Look at the skid marks to the right of the cars.... It drives home for me the idea that a truck picked the switch. It was likely the rear of the 2nd car. The front of the 2nd car pushed the 1st car off the tracks, and the 1st car twisted & lifted the loco, even one foot could do it, off the trucks, and it flipped over once it was not resting on the trucks properly.

I didn't notice where the rear car was till just a few minutes ago. It really makes total sense.

[scoostraw]

After viewing additional video and looking again at some photos, it looks like the locomotive sustained quite extensive damage, and may not be salvageable. The carbody is crushed in enough to have contacted the mechanical equipment inside, the roof is buckled, the cab itself is just destroyed, the trucks coming off is very strange, and the fact that one is still on the rails baffles me.

VIA could lease a P42 from amtrak if losing the one locomotive adversely affects operations.

It's almost as if the cars left the rails, tipped - and took the locomotive with them - rotating it off its trucks. It's too bad there isn't a security camera somewhere in the vicinity that might have caught the incident.

Something I just noticed: the rear of the last car is still within the switch on the converging side.
http://bdnpull.bangorpublishing.netdna- ... 00x413.jpg

Look at the skid marks to the right of the cars.... It drives home for me the idea that a truck picked the switch. It was likely the rear of the 2nd car. The front of the 2nd car pushed the 1st car off the tracks, and the 1st car twisted & lifted the loco, even one foot could do it, off the trucks, and it flipped over once it was not resting on the trucks properly.

I didn't notice where the rear car was till just a few minutes ago. It really makes total sense.

I agree that is very plausible. The crew would have had no idea what was happening.

Do we know which track they were crossing from and to?

[25Hz]

Being in an unforgiving steel cab that is plowing through stuff and violently moving really is a recipe for not good stuff to happen. I'm not surprised. Sad but not surprised. I'm wondering if one of them in the cab had a chance to hit the brake. If so they definitely saved lives. Can you imagine how much worse it'd be if it had more momentum?

I'm less confused and more wanting results from the investigation. This should not have happened. And, more importantly, imagine if it had been a tall bilevel GO train? Sigh.

And no, the tracks are owned by CN. The area is surprisingly industrial with many yards along the lakeshore west line/niagara falls-Toronto corridor. Hamilton has a thriving steel industry among other things.

[Ken V]

The Canadian Transportation Safety Board held a press conference this morning. The indications from the event recorder (black box) shows the train was going 67 mph when it took the crossover with no signs of any attempt to slow down. While we may have a better idea of what happened, we still do not know why it happened and may not for a while, if ever.

[scoostraw]

The Canadian Transportation Safety Board held a press conference this morning. The indications from the event recorder (black box) indicate the train was going 67 mph when it took the crossover with no indication of any attempt to slow down. While we may have a better idea of what happened, we still do not know why it happened and may not for a while, if ever.

Wow.