All Things Portal Bridge: Amtrak and NJT Status and Replacement Discussion

[philipmartin]

At 11:54am, Portal Bridge opened for a test and when they closed the bridge, they were unable to close the catenary.

Why didn't they just issue "drop pantograph" orders for Portal, and let the trains go.

[sixty-six]

At 11:54am, Portal Bridge opened for a test and when they closed the bridge, they were unable to close the catenary.

Why didn't they just issue "drop pantograph" orders for Portal, and let the trains go.

How would they be able to fix the catenary if they have trains going by on the track the ET crews would use for access to said broken catenary?

[philipmartin]

How would they be able to fix the catenary if they have trains going by on the track the ET crews would use for access to said broken catenary?

I didn't think of that. I guess I'll stick to selling tickets.

[fishmech]

I do wonder why the PRR hadn't converted its New York City area swing bridges to lift bridges (Including both Portal and the Raritan Bay one). It's my understanding that lift bridges are both more reliable in general as well as easier to use with a railroad (it seems its a lot more hassle to deal with connecting rails on a swinging bridge than with a lift bridge). They converted the Delair bridge down near Philly to a lift bridge after all, and my understanding is that it was more reliable after that as well.

Anyway back when that Amtrak train hit a miter rail on Portal Bridge that had been raised up by an incorrect closure, and fell into the swamp on the other side of the bridge after skidding against the guardrail, they had trains using the using the other track that is usually westbound to keep service going through while they repaired the messed up catenary on the eastbound side from the derailed train and the rails on that side. If Amtrak and NJTransit could handle using a single track on Portal while repairing the other track's catenary and rails back then (mid-90s) why can't they do it now Jimzim66?

[sullivan1985]

At 11:54am, Portal Bridge opened for a test and when they closed the bridge, they were unable to close the catenary.

Why didn't they just issue "drop pantograph" orders for Portal, and let the trains go.

I guess you COULD do that, but it seems like whoever was in chare looed at it like "what if an engine doesn't come back online after dropping the pan". That 5 pount bag is already pretty full at Portal every day and we all know how bad it smells. Last thing you need is a disabled train on the High-Line between Portal and Swift at 4pm.

[cruiser939]

If Amtrak and NJTransit could handle using a single track on Portal while repairing the other track's catenary and rails back then (mid-90s) why can't they do it now Jimzim66?

Someone must not have been very good at reading comprehension in school. Reading back, it's easy to understand that both tracks were affected and that when they did fix the first track, it was returned to service.

http://www.railroad.net/forums/viewtopi ... =a#p744913

[cruiser939]

I have an somewhat off the topic question.

That's a good indication that you should start a new thread.

I didn't want to start a whole thread just a curious question but ok just ignore it. JC

If everyone had this opinion, then all we'd have here is one mega thread. It's not a big deal to start a new thread. Think of it as an adventure.

[philipmartin]

it seems its a lot more hassle to deal with connecting rails on a swinging bridge than with a lift bridge).

I've operated all three types of railroad bridges, lift, swing and bascule, and found them all equally easy to operate. After you land the swing bridge, line it up, stick in the wedges, lock it, and drop the miter rails; you can take off the derails, raise the smash boards, and pull up the signals. At Portal they have the additional step of running the catenary out. Its on a trolley that runs in and out; at least it used to be. If a miter rail comes down on top of its fixed half, you might have to bang it with something, so it will flop down, into place.

[Grump]

Coasting over Portal has its risks...
Based on the speed trains would be crawling over Portal Bridge during a single track operation, especially during peak periods, it would only be a matter of time someone would stall in the dead section...

[philipmartin]

I wasn't really serious about "drop pantograph" orders for Portal, because of the possibility of tying up the high line. I don't even know if they are still in Amtrak's electrical operating instructions. But I know that they used to be because I'm looking at an Amtrak book dated 1979/1984. Earlier the same day that we are talking about, 3223 had trouble getting his pantograph up, standing in front of me at Middletown.

[philipmartin]

3223's equipment west east a few hour later behind a GP40.

[blockline4180]

I wasn't really serious about "drop pantograph" orders for Portal, because of the possibility of tying up the high line. I don't even know if they are still in Amtrak's electrical operating instructions. But I know that they used to be because I'm looking at an Amtrak book dated 1979/1984. Earlier the same day that we are talking about, 3223 had trouble getting his pantograph up, standing in front of me at Middletown.

Huh, The book from 1979/1984 is the same today????

[Sirsonic]

I will be surrendering myself to choo choo prison Monday morning. All are welcome to gather for my "perp walk" from the MMC platform to the ROC.

I always thought the MMC/ROC felt like a prison...

[RDG-LNE]

I do wonder why the PRR hadn't converted its New York City area swing bridges to lift bridges (Including both Portal and the Raritan Bay one). They converted the Delair bridge down near Philly to a lift bridge after all, and my understanding is that it was more reliable after that as well.

The Delair Bridge was converted to a lift span by the Army Corps of Engineers to allow ships headed up the Delaware River to the new U. S. Steel mill at Fairless, PA. The lift span created a larger opening than the older rotating span. The PRR didn't have to pay for this so they went along with it, remember that at this time PRR was losing money.

Even though the Delair's lift span is younger than the bridges being discussed in North Jersey it still has its problems. Just today after an opening the AC Line dispatcher was unable to get a signal for a train to cross the bridge because he was unable to reach the CSAO train dispatcher in order for CSAO to lock down their side of the bridge. Other times they can't get the locks to apply/remove mechanically or the bridge to close properly.

Drew

[cruiser939]

I do wonder why the PRR hadn't converted its New York City area swing bridges to lift bridges (Including both Portal and the Raritan Bay one). They converted the Delair bridge down near Philly to a lift bridge after all, and my understanding is that it was more reliable after that as well.

The Delair Bridge was converted to a lift span by the Army Corps of Engineers to allow ships headed up the Delaware River to the new U. S. Steel mill at Fairless, PA. The lift span created a larger opening than the older rotating span. The PRR didn't have to pay for this so they went along with it, remember that at this time PRR was losing money.

Even though the Delair's lift span is younger than the bridges being discussed in North Jersey it still has its problems. Just today after an opening the AC Line dispatcher was unable to get a signal for a train to cross the bridge because he was unable to reach the CSAO train dispatcher in order for CSAO to lock down their side of the bridge. Other times they can't get the locks to apply/remove mechanically or the bridge to close properly.

Drew

Delair Bridge has frequent problems.