Superliner Catenary question

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Pensyfan19
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Superliner Catenary question

Post by Pensyfan19 » Tue Jan 14, 2020 3:28 pm

Since the superliners used for the Capitol Limited can fit under the catenary for DC, and there is evidence that the Cardinal used to run superliners for some time from DC (https://railpictures.net/photo/722335/), then wouldn't they fit under the northeast corridor between DC and NY, or are some of the tunnels too low? (I know most of the high level platforms would not fit for the superliners, but I am focusing on if they fit under northeast corridor catenary).
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Tadman
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Re: Superliner Catenary question

Post by Tadman » Tue Jan 14, 2020 3:48 pm

The tunnels in Baltimore and New York won't fit Superliners. At some point the wire is low enough that they cut the power, I think either Boston or H'burg are two places this happens.
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MACTRAXX
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Re: Superliner Catenary question

Post by MACTRAXX » Tue Jan 14, 2020 4:24 pm

PF: I will second Tadman and mention that the catenary is too low in portions of the NEC to adequately
clear the use of Superliner cars. You are already aware that Superliners are built for low level platform
operation. The former B&O route into Washington has only a short segment of overhead category on
or at the beginning of the route near Union Station and the Ivy City maintenance yards.

A good example that I recall about Superliner equipment and catenary clearance is at 30th Street Station.
There was an equipment display during a special event - Track 1 has a low-level maintenance platform on
one side allowing access - the catenary wire above the cars cleared the roof by a matter of inches - close
enough that the wire was de-energized when the Superliner equipment was placed on that track. With AC
current there has to be adequate clearance to prevent any possibility of a dangerous arc or flash-over.

MACTRAXX
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Matt Johnson
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Re: Superliner Catenary question

Post by Matt Johnson » Tue Jan 14, 2020 9:35 pm

As others have mentioned, tunnel clearances preclude it. But apparently Philly - Harrisburg is feasible. Here's something you don't see every day:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_N7WJdB-Q8U

east point
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Re: Superliner Catenary question

Post by east point » Tue Jan 14, 2020 11:45 pm

As mentioned CAT clearances are one problem for Superliners. A quick summary probably wrong at some places is
1. Newark Penn station . No doubt SLs will not clear CAT alt on the NEC though they would also be too close to the platform canopies .A further problem is the out of service RR bridge of the CNJ is too low to raise CAT.
2. Trenton believe is OK
3. Zoo interlocking tunnels ???
4. PHL 30th St tracks 1 - 8 CAT too low and cannot be raised due to low ceiling. However the out of service past tracks 9 - 10 had higher ceilings but would require changing parking lot and new CAT + re building tracks that were removed.
5. Wilmington ??
6. Baltimore Union tunnel east of station believe only one track clearance OK for NS freights ?
7. B&P tunnel might need gauntlet track reinstalled ?
8. WASH Union station Believe CAT raised enough ?

MNRR CAT clearances have no idea ?

Then again SLs cannot make NYP so moot points.
Then of course SLs are low level boarding and would need some kind of portable steps inside car for passengers to step up ?

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Re: Superliner Catenary question

Post by MACTRAXX » Wed Jan 15, 2020 12:04 am

MJ: Thanks for posting this video from 2015 dating from around the time of the
Papal Visit in Philadelphia - the 6 car Superliner sleeping car trainset was being
used to house employees at PHL - does anyone remember if this train was kept
on track #1 or in the Penn Coach Yard? This was smart thinking by Amtrak for
their employees instead of dealing with the logistical problems of the Papal Visit.

After reading the comments there was only one mention of the prime reason
other than the excess height that Superliner cars are not used on Keystones
which is that they can only use low level platforms. As example Lancaster is a
station this equipment will not be able to serve - all others do have at least one
low-level platform available including Track #1 at PHL - provided that the wire
is de-energized before the Superliner cars are placed on that track...MACTRAXX
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Backshophoss
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Re: Superliner Catenary question

Post by Backshophoss » Wed Jan 15, 2020 12:22 am

SUPERLINERS don't clear 3rd rail or the New Haven cat,too wide and too high
Cannot clear the Hi-Level platforms as well
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east point
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Re: Superliner Catenary question

Post by east point » Wed Jan 15, 2020 12:36 am

Thanks for the 3rd rail note. Did not even think about 3rd rails . Fortunately none Newark - WASH.

frequentflyer
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Re: Superliner Catenary question

Post by frequentflyer » Wed Jan 15, 2020 10:55 am

Superliners are 16 ft tall. Yet BBD multilevels are 14 1/2 ft tall and they run up and down the NEC. Guess that 1.5 ft makes a big difference.

rcthompson04
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Re: Superliner Catenary question

Post by rcthompson04 » Wed Jan 15, 2020 12:32 pm

MACTRAXX wrote:
Wed Jan 15, 2020 12:04 am
MJ: Thanks for posting this video from 2015 dating from around the time of the
Papal Visit in Philadelphia - the 6 car Superliner sleeping car trainset was being
used to house employees at PHL - does anyone remember if this train was kept
on track #1 or in the Penn Coach Yard? This was smart thinking by Amtrak for
their employees instead of dealing with the logistical problems of the Papal Visit.

After reading the comments there was only one mention of the prime reason
other than the excess height that Superliner cars are not used on Keystones
which is that they can only use low level platforms. As example Lancaster is a
station this equipment will not be able to serve - all others do have at least one
low-level platform available including Track #1 at PHL - provided that the wire
is de-energized before the Superliner cars are placed on that track...MACTRAXX
They cannot serve Paoli or Exton now since the introduction of high-level platforms only.

What are the highest freight cars that run out there?

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Re: Superliner Catenary question

Post by MACTRAXX » Wed Jan 15, 2020 1:10 pm

RCT: Was the eastbound low level platform alongside the station building at Paoli
fenced off with the opening of the new high level island platform?
If so are there gates allowing the low platform to be used if it is necessary?
I have not been to PAO since the new station facilities were opened...MACTRAXX
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ExCon90
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Re: Superliner Catenary question

Post by ExCon90 » Wed Jan 15, 2020 2:40 pm

The low-level platform on Track 1 at 30th St. is accessible only by a sort of square-spiral stairwell from the space outside the main concourse--not at all practical for regular use in revenue service, or even for wheeled luggage. I'm not sure whether there's any elevator access to that platform, but if there is, it's obscure. In any case, dwell time would be interminable.

I can't remember where the superliners were parked during the papal visit, but it wasn't in 30th St. station.

rcthompson04
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Re: Superliner Catenary question

Post by rcthompson04 » Wed Jan 15, 2020 5:26 pm

MACTRAXX wrote:
Wed Jan 15, 2020 1:10 pm
RCT: Was the eastbound low level platform alongside the station building at Paoli
fenced off with the opening of the new high level island platform?
If so are there gates allowing the low platform to be used if it is necessary?
I have not been to PAO since the new station facilities were opened...MACTRAXX
The westbound side is completely fenced off and the eastbound side appears to be as well. There might be a gate under the far end by Valley Road, but I don't think there is one. I get the point of going high-level exclusively at Paoli, but Exton makes even less sense with the middle track.

polybalt
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Re: Superliner Catenary question

Post by polybalt » Thu Jan 16, 2020 3:54 pm

Last I knew, the lowest actual catenary height on the south end is under the CSX bridge in Cheverly, MD. It will not clear superliners.
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rcthompson04
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Re: Superliner Catenary question

Post by rcthompson04 » Thu Jan 16, 2020 8:27 pm

From the video above, I am curious why there was an engine swap at Harrisburg when the Superliners were only going to 30th Street. How would they have got to Harrisburg in the first place? Did Norfolk Southern bring them all the way from Chicago?

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