WMATA 5000 series cars

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Counterfeit parts used on 5000 series cars.

Postby JackRussell » Fri Sep 14, 2018 8:45 am

https://wtop.com/tracking-metro-24-7/20 ... intenance/

Metro’s 5000 Series cars have been perennially more prone to breakdowns than most others in the fleet, which has led the agency to plan to retire the cars by the end of the year.

By 2010, an electrical part used to transfer power from the third rail to the car had begun to “routinely and catastrophically” fail in 2010, the report of investigation said.

Metro engineers brought in an electronics company to deal with the issue, and it suggested pairing the insulated gate bipolar transistor with another part.

“The OIG investigation revealed the company misrepresented the IGBTs as their own by physically altering the exterior housing and providing product literature, potentially in violation of the original manufacturer’s copyright,” the report said.
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Re: Counterfeit parts used on 5000 series cars.

Postby davinp » Fri Sep 14, 2018 10:42 am

This could be 1 reason the 5000 series are so unreliable. I had a saw chart that they are nearly as unreliable as the 4000 series were.
Metro had called them lemons. So, Metro decided to retire them early instead of rehabilitating them and ordered extra 7000 series cars to replace them.
Earlier this year, Metro posted a request for disposal of the 5000 series cars, which are sitting in Metro railyards.
Only 58 5K series cars are in service as of May 2018
https://www.wmata.com/about/board/meeti ... Update.pdf

The 5000 series were manufactured by CAF, a Spanish company, and this is the first time CAF made railcars for an American transit agency.
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Re: Counterfeit parts used on 5000 series cars.

Postby STrRedWolf » Sat Sep 15, 2018 9:38 am

Do we have a comprehensive list of issues these 5000 series have? Because from what I'm hearing, anything electrical or motive was just plain crap and shouldn't of been allowed on the rails to begin with. Is the shell still good?
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Re: WMATA 5000 series cars

Postby mtuandrew » Mon Sep 17, 2018 6:25 pm

Moderator Note: merged some topics.
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Re: WMATA 5000 series cars

Postby farecard » Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:57 pm

There's lots of counterfeit semiconductors out there; I'm not surprised they got bit on some IGBT's.
But that is no reason to dump the series; just find the right parts.
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Re: Counterfeit parts used on 5000 series cars.

Postby mtuandrew » Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:43 pm

STrRedWolf wrote:Do we have a comprehensive list of issues these 5000 series have? Because from what I'm hearing, anything electrical or motive was just plain crap and shouldn't of been allowed on the rails to begin with. Is the shell still good?

Was wondering about their shells too, and if they could be made into 6000s. The 2000s and 3000s were made essentially identical at their midlife overhaul, but they came from the same builder unlike the 5 and 6ks.
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Re: Counterfeit parts used on 5000 series cars.

Postby D40LF » Fri Sep 21, 2018 11:22 pm

STrRedWolf wrote:Do we have a comprehensive list of issues these 5000 series have? Because from what I'm hearing, anything electrical or motive was just plain crap and shouldn't of been allowed on the rails to begin with. Is the shell still good?


The issues all seem to be electrical and mechanical. The 5Ks were the first series built with enhanced crashworthiness features, and I haven't heard of any serious corrosion problems with them, so the shells are probably fine.
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Re: Counterfeit parts used on 5000 series cars.

Postby davinp » Mon Sep 24, 2018 7:57 am

D40LF wrote:
STrRedWolf wrote:Do we have a comprehensive list of issues these 5000 series have? Because from what I'm hearing, anything electrical or motive was just plain crap and shouldn't of been allowed on the rails to begin with. Is the shell still good?


The issues all seem to be electrical and mechanical. The 5Ks were the first series built with enhanced crashworthiness features, and I haven't heard of any serious corrosion problems with them, so the shells are probably fine.


As the 5000 series are only 17 years old, their bodies should still be in good shape.
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Re: Counterfeit parts used on 5000 series cars.

Postby mtuandrew » Mon Sep 24, 2018 10:46 am

davinp wrote:As the 5000 series are only 17 years old, their bodies should still be in good shape.

All the better for Reynolds when the 5ks go to the aluminum foil factory.

I think if I worked at CAF, I’d be sending a rep down to DC and proposing a mid-life rebuild.
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Metro retires 5000 series today and twitter rejoices

Postby davinp » Fri Oct 12, 2018 6:56 pm

If you’re a Metro rider who rejoiced when the company got rid of its oldest and worst railcars in 2017, there was more good news for you Friday.

Metro is retiring its entire 5000-series fleet, and Friday was the last day the cars would be in service.

https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/loca ... 33171.html
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Re: Metro retires 5000 series today and twitter rejoices

Postby dcmike » Sat Oct 13, 2018 12:03 pm

Twitter users are apparently moronic hypocrites.

On one hand they constantly complain about wasteful spending at Metro, but they're going to rejoice that Metro is now going to pay a company to haul away 192 cars that we spent hundreds of millions dollars engineering out all of design flaws over the past 5 years, and easily have 15-20 years left on the car bodies. Rejoice? I know Knorr-Bemse and Ametek are certainly rejoicing with the size of the contracts we let for them to overhaul and redesign the HVAC and propulsion systems.
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Re: WMATA 5000 series cars

Postby mtuandrew » Sat Oct 13, 2018 1:50 pm

Moderator Note: merged threads.
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Re: Metro retires 5000 series today and twitter rejoices

Postby davinp » Mon Oct 15, 2018 11:22 am

dcmike wrote:Twitter users are apparently moronic hypocrites.

On one hand they constantly complain about wasteful spending at Metro, but they're going to rejoice that Metro is now going to pay a company to haul away 192 cars that we spent hundreds of millions dollars engineering out all of design flaws over the past 5 years, and easily have 15-20 years left on the car bodies. Rejoice? I know Knorr-Bemse and Ametek are certainly rejoicing with the size of the contracts we let for them to overhaul and redesign the HVAC and propulsion systems.


Too bad Metro couldn't find another use for them. As you know, they were purchased with federal funds and so Metro had to get permission from the Feds to retire them early. In 2019, Metro will send them to the scrap yard. I don't know if doing the mid-life overhaul would make them more reliable. Metro chose to use the money to buy more 7000 series cars instead of rehabbing the 5000 series. The 4000 series were 27 years old when they got retired and the 2000/3000 series will be 40 years old by the time they get retired.
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Re: WMATA 5000 series cars

Postby YOLO » Mon Oct 15, 2018 5:11 pm

Metro screwed up and ran a bunch of 5Ks in revenue service today... anyone catch one?
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Re: WMATA 5000 series cars

Postby srepetsk » Mon Oct 15, 2018 8:38 pm

YOLO wrote:Metro screwed up and ran a bunch of 5Ks in revenue service today... anyone catch one?

10 cars (5 pairs) were released into service today.
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