B&H 4, B&H 5, LAL 14 Scrapped

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BR&P
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Re: FYI..... B&H #4

Post by BR&P » Mon May 06, 2019 10:51 pm

lvrr325 wrote:- C630 Demos
- C424 Demo/first built
- this unit

So they gave one away.
Guess I got it wrong. I thought it was LA&L Railroad Company, not LA&L Railroad Historical Society. Apparently their job is not hauling freight and making money, it's preserving locomotives.

Look, a few years ago there was an LV caboose in imminent danger of being cut up. A group of people, including some members of this site, reached into their pockets and came up with the cash which ultimately saved the car.

An S-1 weighs what... about 110 tons? Last I heard a few weeks ago short steel was bringing ballpark 9 cents a pound. So one of those locos would bring roughly $19,800 in scrap assuming no heavy parts had been removed for railroad use. Subtract the cost of acetylene and labor and you might possibly buy the other one for let's say $16,000. How much should we put you down for?

Money talks. BS walks.

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Re: FYI..... B&H #4

Post by Matt Langworthy » Tue May 07, 2019 10:39 am

lvrr325 wrote:- C630 Demos
- C424 Demo/first built
- this unit

So they gave one away.
Do you have proof the B&H/LA&L didn't try to find new homes for those units?
Matt Langworthy

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Re: FYI..... B&H #4

Post by Otto Vondrak » Mon May 13, 2019 10:58 pm

Matt Langworthy wrote:The LA&L basically gave (RGVRRM) RS1 #20 the RGVRRM on a long-term loan
Correction: LAL 20 was an outright donation to RGVRRM.
Yes, the LA&L scrapped the 3 RS1 they got from TIOC... but none of them were in running condition.
LAL folks actually set aside parts for RGVRRM, but the scrapper was overzealous and scrapped them, too.

Don't forget, LAL is a business first and foremost.

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Re: FYI..... B&H #4

Post by Matt Langworthy » Tue May 14, 2019 6:23 pm

Thank you for the clarification, Otto. It should also be noted that the LA&L had donated their 45 tonner to RGVRRM in the past and has collaborated on excursions, which should dispell any notion they are hostile to preservation or nostalgia in general.

But... as you say.. .the LA&L is a business above all else. With that in mind, here's something to think about- #4 might have been a target for vandals if she continued to sit out in the yard Cohocton. Thieves might've stripped her copper wiring to pay for drugs or kids might've smashed the glass just for kicks. Either way, that would've reduced the value of #4 for scrapping or as a tax deduction if they'd located a museum/excursion operation willing to take her. And if a vandal fell off #4 and got hurt, he could sue the B&H for having an attractive nuisance. (Like it or not, we live in a litigious society.) As sad as it is to know the old girl is gone for good, I can see why the B&H finally got rid of #4.

I just wish i'd gotten some shots of #4 in operation back inthe day. All I have are shots of #5 at Taylor/Great Western in 1982 and at the Hammondsport waterfront in 1991.
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Re: FYI..... B&H #4

Post by nydepot » Tue May 14, 2019 7:23 pm

If you're going to pretend, after the fact, that a whole lot of bad things could have happened to it or people, then the people who wanted it saved and felt it should be saved, are not wrong in their thinking either.

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Re: FYI..... B&H #4

Post by BR&P » Wed May 15, 2019 8:00 pm

Matt Langworthy wrote:It should also be noted that the LA&L had donated their 45 tonner to RGVRRM in the past
It should be carefully noted that the above is in error. LA&L sold the unit to RG&E in about 1965. RG&E donated the loco. This is not to take anything from LA&L, as noted they host excursions and have contributed to the museum in various ways all the way back to the late 1970's that I'm aware of and maybe farther back than that. But let's not get incorrect "facts" turned into gospel just because it's on the internet.

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Re: FYI..... B&H #4

Post by Matt Langworthy » Thu May 16, 2019 7:31 am

Yeah, I had read somewhere it had been donated by the LA&L but you are correct- RG&E donated the 45 tonner to RGVRRM.
Matt Langworthy

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Re: FYI..... B&H #4

Post by Matt Langworthy » Thu May 16, 2019 7:41 am

nydepot wrote:If you're going to pretend, after the fact, that a whole lot of bad things could have happened to it or people, then the people who wanted it saved and felt it should be saved, are not wrong in their thinking either.
There is no pretense in my statements. The LA&L has a track record of working with a museum. They are likely aware of other museum and excursion operations. Vince Milliken has been with the LA&L for a long time and has a good sense of history. I strongly doubt the LA&L scrapped #4 without looking around for a new home. If someone has porof they didn't, I'd love to see it.

And as asked before, where were all these "fans" of the B&H when there was a fight to save the rails in Hammondsport? I am seeing alot of crocodile tears in this thread. The same folks who are complaining about #4 were either indifferent to the folks who tried save the waterfront in H'port (including me) or said the former B&H managers who owned the waterfront property were entitled to do what they want. Funny how the attitude about private business changed in just a few years, isn't it?
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"It is highly likely that the 1990s were an overrated decade."

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Re: FYI..... B&H #4

Post by thebigham » Fri May 17, 2019 10:23 am

B&H #5 and LAL #14 may have been scrapped in Cohocton. Waiting for confirmation...

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Re: FYI..... B&H #4

Post by BR&P » Fri May 17, 2019 10:47 am

thebigham wrote:B&H #5 and LAL #14 may have been scrapped in Cohocton. Waiting for confirmation...
14 too? :( Another piece of Ontario Central history bites the dust.

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Re: FYI..... B&H #4

Post by nydepot » Fri May 17, 2019 11:14 am

BR&P wrote:
thebigham wrote:B&H #5 and LAL #14 may have been scrapped in Cohocton. Waiting for confirmation...
14 too? :( Another piece of Ontario Central history bites the dust.
Oh sure, now you're sad :wink:

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Re: FYI..... B&H #4

Post by BR&P » Fri May 17, 2019 11:51 am

nydepot wrote:Oh sure, now you're sad :wink:
Never said I wasn't sad about the others, either. I grew up a couple blocks from the NYC's RS1's and sometimes S-2's. I'll tell ya, steam may be better but 4 RS1's wide open dragging up a hill isn't too shabby either. But reality is absolute, and the reality is that 1) there is way less demand for switch engines than there used to be, and 2) machines wear out and at some point it is not worth the money and effort to fix them.

When the engines that you've made many trips on bite the dust, it IS sad. But I'm not reaching into my pocket to save them.

I was not running this day, it was a shirt-and-tie occasion. I'm in the white coat closest to the camera.
img273.jpg

C2629
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Re: FYI..... B&H #4

Post by C2629 » Fri May 17, 2019 4:17 pm

ONCT 14 after it received a fairly standard Ontario Lines paint job, 1982.
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ONCT 14.jpg

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Re: FYI..... B&H #4

Post by BR&P » Fri May 17, 2019 4:26 pm

C2629 wrote:ONCT 14 after it received a fairly standard Ontario Lines paint job, 1982.
And before the paint was even dry, it went out on lease and never came back. :(

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Re: FYI..... B&H #4

Post by NYCRRson » Fri May 17, 2019 7:57 pm

"I'm in the white coat closest to the camera"

How long did that white coat stay white, did you make it through the day without a grease/oil/dirt smudge ?

Reminds me of the time Conrail management decided to give out nice new WHITE leather gloves to the operating employees... Someone in management thought the gloves would look good....

The gloves were too nice to use, Dad left them in the plastic wrapper and I still have them....

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