Penn Station turnaround for Empire Connection?

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wborys
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Penn Station turnaround for Empire Connection?

Post by wborys » Mon Mar 11, 2019 12:04 pm

I'm curious as to the workings of the Amtrak Empire Connection in New York. It travels south down the Hudson River into Manhattan, then terminates in Penn Station. Where (or how) does it convert from Diesel to Electric power? And where (or how) do the locomotives move to the front of the trainset to make the return trip. Thanks...

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Re: Penn Station turnaround for Empire Connection?

Post by Greg Moore » Mon Mar 11, 2019 12:17 pm

Just outside the tunnel to the Empire connection the 3rd rail starts (there's also catenary for emergency use).

That's where the switch over is made.
Once the trains are unloaded, they move to Sunnyside, looped, I believe refueled and brought back into Penn.

I can't recall if restocking the cafe cars on the longer routes is still done in Sunnyside or has been moved directly into Penn (I've read both)
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wborys
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Re: Penn Station turnaround for Empire Connection?

Post by wborys » Mon Mar 11, 2019 2:18 pm

thanks for the timely reply.
Can I assume the locomotives are both electric and diesel-electric?

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Re: Penn Station turnaround for Empire Connection?

Post by JamesRR » Mon Mar 11, 2019 2:49 pm

wborys wrote:thanks for the timely reply.
Can I assume the locomotives are both electric and diesel-electric?
Yes, they are AMD-103 P32 dual-modes - electric pickup via 3rd rail and diesel-electric.

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Re: Penn Station turnaround for Empire Connection?

Post by ryanov » Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:35 am

Greg Moore wrote:Just outside the tunnel to the Empire connection the 3rd rail starts (there's also catenary for emergency use).
I was on a train in the last year that used it, from the report the crew gave -- a motor was sent out to retrieve our train and pull it into Penn Station (I can't recall whether I took a look after alighting from the train).
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Re: Penn Station turnaround for Empire Connection?

Post by Railjunkie » Sat Mar 16, 2019 1:33 am

Greg Moore wrote:Just outside the tunnel to the Empire connection the 3rd rail starts (there's also catenary for emergency use).

That's where the switch over is made.
Once the trains are unloaded, they move to Sunnyside, looped, I believe refueled and brought back into Penn.

I can't recall if restocking the cafe cars on the longer routes is still done in Sunnyside or has been moved directly into Penn (I've read both)
No refuel in Sunnyside all trains are filled or topped off in Albany. The change over to third rail is at CP Empire, basically the U section of the Empire tunnel. Coming north out of the station we start once we he clear A interlocking. Total time on third rail is less than a mile.

The entire section of railroad from CP Empire to MNRR is the Empire connection, not just the tunnel.

I believe the cafes are stocked in Sunnyside. There used to be one or two that were stocked out of Penn. Back in the day we would get in route issues from the Penn commissary.

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Re: Penn Station turnaround for Empire Connection?

Post by jhdeasy » Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:39 pm

Greg Moore wrote:
I can't recall if restocking the cafe cars on the longer routes is still done in Sunnyside or has been moved directly into Penn (I've read both)
Based on my observation last time I was at Sunnyside Yard (10/05/2018) with MOUNT VERNON on train 69, Adirondack’s cafe car is stocked at Sunnyside Yard by commissary contractor.

I’m uncertain if the Cafe car service attendant boards at Sunnyside Yard to sign for inventory delivered, or if he boards at Penn Station.

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Re: Penn Station turnaround for Empire Connection?

Post by AmtrakLocomotiveEngineer » Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:46 pm

Regarding the operations to the yard, the dual mode locomotives continue using third rail until the other side of the tunnel. Once out of the tunnel we switch to diesel as there is only a very short section of third rail on the yard lead at F interlocking where the yard leads (Loop 1 & Loop 2) leave the main line. The trains go around the giant loop and into the yard and then the reverse when heading west for the station.

Occasionally when there's a shortage of dual modes, a P42 has been used right into NYP.

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Re: Penn Station turnaround for Empire Connection?

Post by Acela150 » Mon Mar 18, 2019 11:59 pm

Greg Moore wrote: I can't recall if restocking the cafe cars on the longer routes is still done in Sunnyside or has been moved directly into Penn (I've read both)
Very few Empire trains have cafe service. Any trains that go past Albany have cafe service. Otherwise no cafe service.

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Re: Penn Station turnaround for Empire Connection?

Post by Greg Moore » Tue Mar 19, 2019 2:11 pm

Acela150 wrote:
Greg Moore wrote: I can't recall if restocking the cafe cars on the longer routes is still done in Sunnyside or has been moved directly into Penn (I've read both)
Very few Empire trains have cafe service. Any trains that go past Albany have cafe service. Otherwise no cafe service.
Hence why I said, "longer routes".
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Re: Penn Station turnaround for Empire Connection?

Post by danib62 » Thu May 09, 2019 1:02 pm

Speeds on 3rd rail power are limited on the P-32s, right?
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Re: Penn Station turnaround for Empire Connection?

Post by Railjunkie » Thu May 09, 2019 1:14 pm

danib62 wrote:Speeds on 3rd rail power are limited on the P-32s, right?
I do remember my instructor telling me that the speed is limited, 60mph sticks in my head. Never had a need to worry about it. We only use 3rd rail to get into and out of Penn. MAS in the Empire tunnel is 25mph. I dont know about the tubes over to Sunnyside. We dont use 3rd rail on Metro North.

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Re: Penn Station turnaround for Empire Connection?

Post by STrRedWolf » Thu May 09, 2019 7:44 pm

Railjunkie wrote:
danib62 wrote:Speeds on 3rd rail power are limited on the P-32s, right?
I do remember my instructor telling me that the speed is limited, 60mph sticks in my head. Never had a need to worry about it. We only use 3rd rail to get into and out of Penn. MAS in the Empire tunnel is 25mph. I dont know about the tubes over to Sunnyside. We dont use 3rd rail on Metro North.
Those rails are over-running like on the LIRR, right? Or are they over-running like w/Metro North?
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Re: Penn Station turnaround for Empire Connection?

Post by DutchRailnut » Thu May 09, 2019 7:50 pm

The P32acdm max speed in electric was originally 45 mph but upgraded to 60 mph after about two years.
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Re: Penn Station turnaround for Empire Connection?

Post by Backshophoss » Thu May 09, 2019 8:03 pm

Penn is LIRR overrunning 3rd rail all the way to Sunnyside Yard.
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