Where to find old maps in the system

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Re: Where to find old maps in the system

Postby diburning » Sat Dec 04, 2010 2:35 am

I ride the red line almost every day to get to class. I encounter one every week or so. Maybe theres no sticky substance because the maps were peeled slowly?
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Re: Where to find old maps in the system

Postby mattl » Thu Dec 09, 2010 12:00 am

So here's one for you... any maps in the system still showing the E line intact? Plenty of Orange Line maps showing the Arborway stop, but I've yet to see a Green Line map without that white part after Heath St.
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Re: Where to find old maps in the system

Postby TCRT612 » Thu Dec 09, 2010 12:44 am

mattl wrote:So here's one for you... any maps in the system still showing the E line intact? Plenty of Orange Line maps showing the Arborway stop, but I've yet to see a Green Line map without that white part after Heath St.


Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe these maps exist at Harvard Station on the Red Line platforms. Specifically, the maps located on the wall across the tracks from the platform show the E line terminating at Arborway. Perhaps these are still there because their location makes them difficult to access.
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Re: Where to find old maps in the system

Postby jamesinclair » Thu Dec 09, 2010 2:18 am

As of last winter, the map mentioned above was found in Kenmore, Harvard, Davis and other stations.

They probably havent been changed.

Here it is. Also note the commuter rail references.
Kenmore, outbound, in the area the trains dont stop
Image

Bonus:
Image
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Re: Where to find old maps in the system

Postby F-line to Dudley via Park » Thu Dec 09, 2010 2:30 am

mattl wrote:So here's one for you... any maps in the system still showing the E line intact? Plenty of Orange Line maps showing the Arborway stop, but I've yet to see a Green Line map without that white part after Heath St.


Yes, but only in full system spider maps that showed just subway stops and terminals on the branches. There are no maps beyond the white-outline GL branch maps that show every stop on the line. Spider maps from '67 to the mid-80's never showed every single individual surface stop on the A/B/C/E branches, only the D in certain cases. Only the handful of most important stops were cited, as well as any places where a train would conceivably be short-turned. Green Line stations did not have separate branch spider maps as detailed as the ones they do now, naming every single stop on every single branch. It was also a relative rarity for surface stops to have any maps or much in the way of signage on the platform. If the platforms had any markers, it was a tiny pole-attached sign or a generic bus-style sign mounted on top of one of the old aluminum shelters (like Hawes and Kent St. had before they got their new glass shelters). Street-running stops had nothing whatsoever. It still was very much seen as a streetcar line when the A and E were either operating or in "We'll be back real soon! (*wink-wink*)" status, with surface stops in a second tier between the subway and buses. You looked on the train or at a paper map for your stop, like a bus. It was only in the last 20 years when ADA compliance started to become a consideration and they had their first long-range inklings of doing across-the-board electronic prepayment that surface stops started to gain equivalency on signage to subway stops.

The white-outline "temporarily suspended" Arborway maps probably were the first ones installed listing every single stop, and they were installed because Back of the Hill was a brand new infill stop added to the line when service from Brigham Circle to Heath ultimately resumed in 1989. That, along with the name change of Auditorium to Hynes and the total renovation of Park St., were the impetus for refreshing all of the intra-GL maps in unison between about '87-90. It was, until station renovations in the late-90's started their removal, pretty much universally deployed at all GL subway stops...including the special Hynes and Kenmore versions that just showed the dots instead of station names for E stops (Hynes still has it). The systemwide spider maps on the other lines, including the 1983-vintage ones on the Red Line Alewife extension that still show Arborway to this day, weren't affected enough to merit change-outs (even with Hynes still showing as "Auditorium" on ones that weren't later retouched). Since there was so little in the way of signage at the surface stops it's unlikely they had to do much at all outside the subway to update for the late-80's changes. A handful of surface stops did sport that Hynes/Kenmore-style map that had just dots/no-names for the other branches and white outline for Arborway, but they were original installations done when metal signage started cropping up at BU East/Central/West and the like. I don't think there are any left because of all the ADA renovations and platform shelter replacements. BU West might've been one of the last since it's still an un-renovated stop, but I'm almost positive its maps were updated at BU's behest.


Ironically, the newest "Arborway is just taking a beauty rest" map on the entire system is at North Station on the upper level...still up as of 6 months ago. Must've been installed a few years before the GL inbound platform actually opened, but it's the honest-to-god 1989 temporary suspension spider map printed with the early-00's style font. I can't believe they didn't change that out before the new superstation opened, but it's somehow lasted 6 years. Right on the platform adorning a support column, but isn't visible from the whole expanse of lobby behind it so not conspicuously displayed.
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Re: Where to find old maps in the system

Postby rhodiecub2 » Sat Dec 11, 2010 10:40 am

Was a similar style spider map of the GL that came before the restoration to Heath St? I think I remember seeing a GL map around early 1989 that showed the E branch going as far as Brigham Circle and Hynes Convention Ctr was still Auditorium.
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Re: Where to find old maps in the system

Postby TCRT612 » Sat Dec 11, 2010 1:12 pm

F-line to Dudley via Park wrote:BU West might've been one of the last since it's still an un-renovated stop, but I'm almost positive its maps were updated at BU's behest.


I walked by BU West last night, and despite having been renovated with new shelters within the past year, to my surprise it actually still has the Green Line maps with the "suspended" Arborway branch in white but with all stops listed between Copley and Arborway (the same map that is still present at Hynes).
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Re: Where to find old maps in the system

Postby F-line to Dudley via Park » Sat Dec 11, 2010 6:26 pm

rhodiecub2 wrote:Was a similar style spider map of the GL that came before the restoration to Heath St? I think I remember seeing a GL map around early 1989 that showed the E branch going as far as Brigham Circle and Hynes Convention Ctr was still Auditorium.


1986-89 the E only went as far as Brigham because they were relocating Forest Hills and replacing track on the entire street-running portion (that's right, entire...all of the non-restored route had its track replaced, but never the catenary to make it LRV-operational). Service to Heath Loop belatedly reopened in '89. So yes, that was a short-lived configuration. I'm surprised it made its way onto a single map, though.
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Re: Where to find old maps in the system

Postby mattl » Thu Dec 16, 2010 1:18 pm

I have now managed to pick up paper copies of the 1974 and 1982 system maps showing the E Line... I would like to get one from the 60s, showing the A line.
Oh, I bet you read a lot of Gordon Wood, huh? You read your Gordon Wood and you regurgitate it from a textbook, and you think you're awesome doing that and how 'bout them apples and all that Gordon Wood business?
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Re: Where to find old maps in the system

Postby rhodiecub2 » Sun May 17, 2015 8:50 am

Old Green Line map.jpg


Found this old green line map on the Winter Street Concourse last summer. Looks like a late 70s era map.
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Re: Where to find old maps in the system

Postby F-line to Dudley via Park » Sun May 17, 2015 10:04 am

rhodiecub2 wrote:
Old Green Line map.jpg


Found this old green line map on the Winter Street Concourse last summer. Looks like a late 70s era map.


Or early-80's. Wow...I didn't think there were any survivors left that still had "Auditorium" as the name for Hynes.
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Re: Where to find old maps in the system

Postby deathtopumpkins » Sun May 17, 2015 10:34 am

I note that that map labels Fenway as Fenway Park as well. I've never seen that before. I guess the current practice of directing Sox fans to Kenmore hasn't always been the case then.
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Re: Where to find old maps in the system

Postby BandA » Sun May 17, 2015 12:13 pm

I remember seeing maps with "A" Watertown possibly into the 80's. Occasionally you'd also see a map that had been patched over.
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Re: Where to find old maps in the system

Postby Adams_Umass_Boston » Sun May 17, 2015 2:49 pm

Last week, I I posted this 1967 Spider map to my works Twitter account.

https://twitter.com/BACLibrary/status/5 ... 2731316224

Found in out collection.
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Re: Where to find old maps in the system

Postby Arborwayfan » Sun May 17, 2015 8:43 pm

I think the new Orange Line stations (SWC) from Back Bay to Forest Hills might have had maps with the E line suspended beyond Brigham Circle. They showed the whole line in green but had the suspended notice and the black dashed line for the 39 bus. In those years the 39 was actually the substitute trolley: you paid subway fare going inbound and nothing going out above ground, and the there were free transfers at Copley in both directions.
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