Dumping sand

General discussion about locomotives, rolling stock, and equipment

Moderator: John_Perkowski

Dumping sand

Postby CLamb » Mon Jan 19, 2015 9:16 pm

Is sand ever dumped automatically when triggered by wheels losing adhesion or is it always under manual control?
CLamb
 
Posts: 181
Joined: Fri Nov 18, 2005 11:29 pm
Location: Scotch Plains, NJ

Re: Dumping sand

Postby DutchRailnut » Tue Jan 20, 2015 7:09 am

all current locomotives trigger the sanders when wheel slip or emergency braking occurs.
Plus there is manual sanding available to Engineer.
If Conductors are in charge, why are they promoted to be Engineer???

Retired Triebfahrzeugführer
User avatar
DutchRailnut
 
Posts: 21202
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 8:02 pm
Location: released from Stalag 13

Re: Dumping sand

Postby ExCon90 » Tue Jan 20, 2015 3:10 pm

Some railroads have a rule forbidding sanding in interlockings. Have there been any problems resulting from automatic sanding while passing through an interlocking?
ExCon90
 
Posts: 3468
Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2008 1:22 pm

Re: Dumping sand

Postby DutchRailnut » Thu Jan 22, 2015 12:53 pm

The Railroad can prohibit all they want, there is no control over Automatic sanders other than turning of Circuit breaker.
But if you do that, and you need to dump air and need sand, it would become a liability issue.
plus under railroad rules the FRA would consider that, cutting out a safety device.
If Conductors are in charge, why are they promoted to be Engineer???

Retired Triebfahrzeugführer
User avatar
DutchRailnut
 
Posts: 21202
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 8:02 pm
Location: released from Stalag 13

Re: Dumping sand

Postby ExCon90 » Thu Jan 22, 2015 3:33 pm

Thanks for the reply--I kind of thought there would be a conflict there. I guess if sand gets dumped in an interlocking they just have to live with it. In fact, even before automatic sanding, if an engineer was in a situation where sanding was necessary to keep something worse from happening, would that get the engineer off the hook as far as a rule violation was concerned? Or would that depend on what kind of superintendent they had?
ExCon90
 
Posts: 3468
Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2008 1:22 pm

Re: Dumping sand

Postby DutchRailnut » Fri Jan 23, 2015 8:14 pm

in 30 years I never got challenged about use of sand, so I don't know ;-)
If Conductors are in charge, why are they promoted to be Engineer???

Retired Triebfahrzeugführer
User avatar
DutchRailnut
 
Posts: 21202
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 8:02 pm
Location: released from Stalag 13

Re: Dumping sand

Postby Engineer Spike » Thu Feb 05, 2015 10:15 am

I understand that sanding over switches would defeat the lubrication on the plates. Oh well, the MOW has a little extra work. Our PTC equipped SD40s would sometimes sand for slips real or imagined. Sometimes it would only take opening or closing the throttle. This worried me more if I was running light. There have been accidents where a light locomotive stopped on sanded rail, and the sand insulated the signals. Boston and Maine had a wreck inside Hoosac Tunnel because a sander stuck open. This caused the following movement to hit a stopped light engine.
"Welcome all ye who enter; the show that never ends. Tingfield Sperminal Railway." (Graffiti on the entry to Mohawk Yard Office)
Engineer Spike
 
Posts: 1655
Joined: Tue Mar 16, 2004 3:24 pm

Re: Dumping sand

Postby JWilson » Wed Sep 23, 2015 10:09 pm

Unless the pile of sand is on the points AND big enough to interfere with the movement, thus causing an out-of-correspondence icon to light up on the Dispatchers board then it's just more dirt on the railroad as usual. Either way, good luck proving who left it there.
JWilson
 
Posts: 47
Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2011 10:54 pm

Re: Dumping sand

Postby amtrakhogger » Thu Sep 24, 2015 12:33 am

"Excessive use of sand is prohibited."
"I will stop at St. Avold."
User avatar
amtrakhogger
 
Posts: 1842
Joined: Sun Jun 25, 2006 12:16 am
Location: "F" on the Camden and Amboy

Re: Dumping sand

Postby Engineer Spike » Wed Jul 20, 2016 8:24 pm

Sometimes you have to use every tool available to avoid stalling. I mentioned the worry about light engines sanding, then not shunting the signals. Thinking back, this is sort of a moot point. Many rule books require absolute blocks on short trains or drafts.
"Welcome all ye who enter; the show that never ends. Tingfield Sperminal Railway." (Graffiti on the entry to Mohawk Yard Office)
Engineer Spike
 
Posts: 1655
Joined: Tue Mar 16, 2004 3:24 pm

Re: Dumping sand

Postby stevej » Tue Nov 07, 2017 3:07 am

G'day,
Yes, here in NSW, the use of sand for traction is strictly regulated.
All locomotives must possess air blowers fitted behind the wheels to blow off any sand from the rail head after deposited for traction purposes.
After the Hawkesbury River incident where automatic signals returned to clear due to a stalled steam locomotive tour train, sand blowers were mandated.
The regulations also are strict in the amount of sand that can be deposited.
Automatic signals possibly returning to clear behind trains depositing sand for traction has been known for some time.
Quite different to the good ole days when you pounded the sand pedal constantly to maintain traction in wet weather.
Stevej.
User avatar
stevej
 
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Oct 18, 2017 12:43 am
Location: Bathurst NSW Australia


Return to General Discussion: Locomotives, Rolling Stock, and Equipment

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest