Surviving Maine Central Passenger Equipment

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Re: Surviving Maine Central Passenger Equipment

Postby gokeefe » Sat Oct 29, 2016 10:09 am

Absolutely correct. I was stunned in the past couple of years to find that after all this time these cars were still in Maine. I have been inside both of them and unfortunately they are near derelicts. I still wonder if some wood paneling may be hiding underneath the walls. Some of the stained glass is intact but in general any preservation efforts would be closer to reconstruction or replication than saving historic trims, finishes and materials.

Not noted above was the transfer of MEC #2001 to a railroad in Pennsylvania.
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Re: Surviving Maine Central Passenger Equipment

Postby jmlaboda » Sat Oct 29, 2016 12:56 pm

Not noted above was the transfer of MEC #2001 to a railroad in Pennsylvania.


Yup... its on the Colebrookdale awaiting restoration...

http://rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4380342
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Re: Surviving Maine Central Passenger Equipment

Postby gokeefe » Sat Oct 29, 2016 5:06 pm

Late discovery apparently sitting "right in front of the eyes" for quite some time ...

CSRX 1557, Open Air Coach is described as follows:

No. 1557. Former coach, Boston & Maine R.R. 1557, later 557. Sold
to Maine Central R.R. in 1950, converted to boarding car 965. Built by
Laconia Car Co. 1911. Placed in service 1978. Repainted and lettered in
2008. Assigned to the Valley train.


What is not clear to me is whether or not this car was ever on regularly scheduled passenger service with the Maine Central. It would appear based on the above that the answer is "no". It also struck me as strange that at such a late date that the Maine Central would be buying a wood sided steel underframe coach and placing it in regularly scheduled passenger service. Thoughts or further information are appreciated. It does appear that the bulk of Maine Central's heavyweight passenger cars were all moved over to Maintenance of Way over the years. Some must have been scrapped but the number that survived well into the later years of E. Spencer Miller's time as President is quite surprising.
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Re: Surviving Maine Central Passenger Equipment

Postby gokeefe » Thu Nov 17, 2016 1:22 pm

I have been informed that MEC #949 has been scrapped. This was an unfortunate outcome but based on personal inspection of the car in decrepit condition it was entirely understandable. MEC #392, one of the three "late" acquisitions by MEC/Guilford but with no history of regular passenger service on MEC has recently been reported as intact in Waterville. I will also be adding CSRX #1557 (MEC MoW #965) once the MEC roster number history (if any prior to MoW service) can be clarified. Another "recent" discovery is the possibility that an MEC heavyweight passenger car is sitting intact at the yard in Rockland.

MEC #10, Parlor-Buffet, Spruce, (MEC #336 Baggage-Express, MEC #948 MoW), Belfast & Moosehead Lake Railroad, Thorndike, ME, Stored - Out of Service.

MEC #16, Diner - Lounge, Arundel, Hancock Port Commission, Gulfport, MS, Stored - Out of Service

MEC #155, Coach, McNeil Point, Downeast Scenic Railroad, Ellsworth, ME, Restored - Operating.

MEC #252, Coach (MEC #2011, Instruction Car, ex-MEC #209), Conway Scenic Railroad, North Conway, NH, Stored - Static. Also of note, per reliable sources this car is not on its original trucks. They were switched out and placed under CSRX Gertrude Emma.

MEC #333, Business Observation, Lone Tree, Pan Am Railways, Waterville, ME, Stored (Indoors) - Static. (Lone Tree has been the subject of an ongoing thread for some time on railroad.net here)

MEC #322, Power Car Combine, Pan Am Railways, Waterville, ME, Stored (Outdoors) - Static.

MEC #390, Coach (Heritage, AMTK #5444, PC #4044, PRR #4044), Pan Am Railways(?), Waterville, ME, Out of Service - Unknown. (Further research appears to indicate this car did not ever belong to the MEC during their passenger service era, MEC #390 (exxx-PRR 4044) was built for and saw service on the PRR train Southwind).

MEC #391, Chair - Cafe - Foodservice (Buffet?) (MEC #391, AMTK #3951, PC(?) #3211, NYC #3211, NYC #3011), City Point Central Railroad, Belfast, ME, Preserved - Static(?). (This coach also never operated on the MEC during their passenger service era, according to Bruce Cooper (as posted on NE Rail Photo) its heritage is AMTK #3951, NYC #3211, NYC #3011). Part of a 153 car order for 64 seat coaches by the NYC in 1948 to Pullman Standard (Plan #7484, Lot #2169, some others indicate Lot #6721).

MEC #409, Railway Post Office, Conway Scenic Railroad, North Conway, NH, Stored - Static. (Used as tool car by CSRX, interior condition unknown, wood exterior)

MEC #411, Railway Post Office (ex-PC, exx-NH W331 (MoW) exxx-NH, exxxx-MEC #352), Railroad Museum of New England, Stored - Under Restoration (steel exterior)

MEC #501, Combine, Cooperville & Marne Railway Company, Marne, MI, Stored - Static. (Interior photos show this car to be largely intact and in excellent shape). This car was also at one time in service on the "Otter Valley Railroad Tourist Train" in Proctor, Vermont. Other information seems to indicate it was part of the Steamtown Inc. collection at one time (supposedly on loan from MEC, not owned by Steamtown). It was also at one time in the collection of the 470 RR Club as well.

MEC #540, Lumber King, Baggage Coach, (MP #761, MP #562, Grill Coach), Kennekuk County Park, Danville, IL, Preserved - Static. (scroll to bottom of page on Danville, IL link).

MEC #573, EMD GP7 with steam generator for passenger service; known around the railroad as Mr. Miller's Engine; later became DH 573, then ST 27; now preserved and in service as CSRX 573.

MEC #901, MoW Coach (BAR #230), Shelburne Falls Trolley Museum, Shelburne, MA, Stored - Static is not discussed in this post due to the fact that is was never in passenger service (public or private (business)).[/quote]
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Re: Surviving Maine Central Passenger Equipment

Postby gokeefe » Thu Nov 17, 2016 1:23 pm

Is this car still in Rockland or somewhere on the Rockland Branch?

http://photos.nerail.org/s/?p=60323
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Re: Surviving Maine Central Passenger Equipment

Postby jmlaboda » Thu Nov 17, 2016 10:28 pm

MEC #392, one of the three "late" acquisitions by MEC/Guilford but with no history of regular passenger service on MEC has recently been reported as intact in Waterville.


How 'bout a shot of this car in Guilford orange?

http://www.northeast.railfan.net/images/mec392.jpg

Anyone know the history of this car?
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Re: Surviving Maine Central Passenger Equipment

Postby gokeefe » Fri Nov 18, 2016 12:57 pm

Pretty sure this is the combined shot of #390, 391 and 392 prior to repaint.

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=622704

I believe #392 is on the far left.
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Re: Surviving Maine Central Passenger Equipment

Postby gokeefe » Mon Dec 05, 2016 4:05 pm

Without realizing it I have been aware for some time of another car currently at City Point ... this car which is known as "No. 15" (not the wood-sided RPO from many years ago) is intact and in service. It appears to be from the same order as #MEC 252 (ex-#2001). Roster number (MoW or otherwise) are unknown per informed sources.

Further information would be appreciated.
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Re: Surviving Maine Central Passenger Equipment

Postby gokeefe » Sat Jan 07, 2017 1:06 pm

I found this post at Railway Preservation News that gives a very specific chronology of what happened to Maine Central's streamlined cars and am reposting the relevant material here for posterity:

B&M 56 seat coach 10 seat smoking lounge #4806 Chickadee (P-S, 1947, Lot #W6778, Plan #W46352)

One of sixteen cars, with half owned by MEC as #240-#247, and half owned by B&M as #4800-#4807. MEC sold their cars in 1960 to MP as #770-#777, changed to #481-#488 in 1963. B&M sold their cars in 1957 to Wabash as #1417-#1424. The cars went to N&W in the merger as #1824-#1831, but only four of the cars (#1827, #1829-#1831) were renumbered as such. The other four cars were sold to NJDOT in 1968, which also acquired MEC #244 (the other seven went to NdeM via Edwards). NJDOT sold their five cars to Naparano in 1974. Of the four cars actually renumbered to the N&W #18xx-series:

#1827 (#4803 Black Bird/#1420) was sold in 1971 to the Roanoke Chapter and and saw use with the old SOU-NS steam program. This car is now at Monticello Railway Museum in Illinois.

#1831 (#4807 Snowbird/#1424) was converted to air brake instruction car #405 in 1969. NS sold the car to the Nashville & Eastern in 1988. Current status unknown.

#1829 (#4805 Oriole/#1422) and #1830 (#4806 Chickadee/#1423) were sold in 1971 to Jones Properties, which in turn sold the cars to Railroad Passenger Cars Incorporated. The #1829 (RRP #6600) was used on the Chessie System Safety Express as car #15. I don't know if the #1830 saw use on either the Steam Specials or Safety Express. I also don't know the current whereabouts of the #1829.

Sources:

1. "Streamliner Cars Volume One: Pullman Standard" by W. David Randall (RPC Publications, 1981)

2. "Streamliner Cars Volume Two: The Budd Company" by W. David Randall (RPC Publications, 1981)

3. "Streamliner Cars Volume Three: ACF - Other Builders" by W. David Randall (RPC Publications, 1982)

4. "Amtrak by the Numbers" by David C. Warner and Elbert Simon (White River Productions, 2011)

_________________
Ted Brumberg


Naporano is a scrapping company. Safe to assume therefore that MEC #244 was scrapped. The remaining seven cars were all sent to Mexico. Although I have yet to be able to locate any of them today, I would not be in the least bit surprised if some of them were intact.
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Re: Surviving Maine Central Passenger Equipment

Postby jmlaboda » Sat Jan 07, 2017 3:17 pm

#1829 (#4805 Oriole/#1422) and #1830 (#4806 Chickadee/#1423) were sold in 1971 to Jones Properties, which in turn sold the cars to Railroad Passenger Cars Incorporated. The #1829 (RRP #6600) was used on the Chessie System Safety Express as car #15. I don't know if the #1830 saw use on either the Steam Specials or Safety Express. I also don't know the current whereabouts of the #1829.


Three of the B&M/WAB/N&W cars served on the Chessie Steam Special second season it but not for any other season...

B&M 4803 Black Bird/WAB 1420/N&W 1827 (RNRH 1210 John M. Hancock) served on the Chessie Steam Special in 1978 as CSS 12.

B&M 4805 Oriole/WAB 1422/N&W 1829 (RRP 6600) also served, as CSS 13.

B&M 4806 Chickadee/WAB 1423/N&W 1830 (RRP 6601) was CSS 14.

Additional roster information can be found on the Theme Trains website...

http://themetrains.com/main.html
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Re: Surviving Maine Central Passenger Equipment

Postby EDFLD Bill » Sun Feb 05, 2017 3:49 am

gokeefe wrote:Funny you should mention Mr. Ford.

Some of his photos have been posted to rrpicturearchives.net. Due to their exceptional quality and seemingly unusual foreknowledge of special trains some of us who saw these pictures assumed that "Gil Ford" was a pseudonym for someone who had worked for Guilford Transportation. Some of the photos posted on there are among the only known public photos of MEC #333 LONE TREE in the modern era and likely its last known use right around the time of the GTI purchase.


The last use of MEC Business Car 333 was in September 1987 as part of a GTI Inspection Train. It ran out to Binghamton, NY and return. Made a stop for a shin-dig at Belden Tunnel on the way north/east. The consist was B&M 366-D&H 7402-MEC 333-GTI 390-100.
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Re: Surviving Maine Central Passenger Equipment

Postby gokeefe » Fri Feb 10, 2017 11:39 pm

Interesting that it ran without its power car (#322). I'm assuming power was from a generator on #100?
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Re: Surviving Maine Central Passenger Equipment

Postby EDFLD Bill » Sat Feb 11, 2017 12:29 am

gokeefe wrote:Interesting that it ran without its power car (#322). I'm assuming power was from a generator on #100?


The #100 was/is equipped with an underslung diesel generator.
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