Perth Amboy High Level Platforms

Discussion related to New Jersey Transit rail and light rail operations.

Moderators: Tadman, ACeInTheHole, Kaback9, nick11a

Re: Perth Amboy High Level Platforms

Postby sixty-six » Sat Jun 19, 2010 12:07 am

Jtgshu wrote:While creeping down a the Coast Line tonight following a delayed "express" ahead of me, I was thinking how horrendous the scehdules sometimes are on the Coast Line.....

But as cruiser said, "its not the NEC"....so that means its basically a one way road. It might as well be 251 from Graw to Bay Head....


And make MM-8 follow a local?!
sixty-six
 

Re: Perth Amboy High Level Platforms

Postby N-Trizzy2609 » Sat Jun 19, 2010 11:08 am

I saw this coming like 6080 and it's crap horn. I kinda hope they somehow they figure it out. I'm going for the two side platforms. It make more since and it's less $$$!
~TTMG Teamster :: Nicholas B. Maione
This is the Colts Neck bound N Express train. The next and last stop is, Five Points Road/Colts Neck High School.
My Art :: My Music
User avatar
N-Trizzy2609
 
Posts: 117
Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2009 11:44 am
Location: Freehold, NJ

Re: Perth Amboy High Level Platforms

Postby n2cbo » Thu Jun 24, 2010 7:14 pm

E-44 wrote:
Jtgshu wrote:
Remember, it was 4 tracks through there back in the CNJ/PRR days - the inner tracks were the CNJ tracks, the outer the PRR tracks. the CNJ didn't realy stop at PA, while the PRR did

It would be a great area for locals to overtake expresses, most of which don't stop at Perth Amboy anyway. It would be like almost a 2 mile long siding, but would work well because it would allow trains to leapfrog each other before getting to River or up to the elevated part east of the Wood.


JT, I seem to recall that it was the other way around, with CNJ running on the outside and PRR on the inside, at least when CNJ pax service still ran through to Jersey City. I recall as a kid having to step across the outer track to climb up on the P70s and MP54s.

At some point in the '60's when CNJ no longer stopped in Perth Amboy, the gauge on the outer tracks was filled with asphalt to help people cross without tripping.


And I remember that the CNJ DID stop at PA, because when I was a kid, we used to meet my father at the station, and he took the CNJ from Elizabethport to PA.
n2cbo
 
Posts: 415
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2007 10:29 pm

Re: Perth Amboy High Level Platforms

Postby Jtgshu » Thu Jun 24, 2010 10:38 pm

Okay so the CNJ stopped there...thats not really my point, my point is, is that the current two tracks through PA, if you continue straight, line up perfectly with the Chemical Coast - there is space for 2 tracks on the outside of the two current tracks, as thats where the PRR tracks were that were from the Perth Amboy and Woodbridge branch (I believe thats what it was offically called). The one went under the CNJ, that bridge is still there, while the other curved infront of WC (Wood) tower and on the westbound platform side of PA station.

There is plenty of room thorugh the station for a 3rd track to be put in, and proper platforms placed. Actually they could build the high levels back, away from the tracks, were the current low level canapies are, while still maintaining the current low levels and track arrangement. Once done, swing the tracks to the outside to meet up with the then new current high level platforms, leaving plenty of room in the middle for a 3rd (hell or even 4th) track.
On the RR, "believe nothing you hear and only half of what you see"
John, aka "JTGSHU" passed away on August 26, 2013. We honor his memory and his devotion to railroading at railroad.net.
User avatar
Jtgshu
 
Posts: 11744
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 7:32 pm
Location: MP 39.1

Re: Perth Amboy High Level Platforms

Postby Kaback9 » Thu Jun 24, 2010 11:39 pm

A third track would also be nice for running freights through on their way down to Browns.
Brandon Kaback
Moderator:NJT Rail
User avatar
Kaback9
 
Posts: 4467
Joined: Thu Aug 14, 2008 1:48 am

Re: Perth Amboy High Level Platforms

Postby peconicstation » Fri Jun 25, 2010 5:48 am

E-44 wrote:
Jtgshu wrote:
At some point in the '60's when CNJ no longer stopped in Perth Amboy, the gauge on the outer tracks was filled with asphalt to help people cross without tripping.


The CNJ never stopped serving Perth Amboy, in fact after the Aldene Plan, of April 30, 1967, Perth Amboy was the first station stop for CNJ Bay Head trains after leaving Newark, and running via the
NEC.

PRIOR to the Aldene Plan, PA was a key transfer point, as you could transfer between PRR and CNJ trains there.

The outer 2 tracks remained in service until the 1970's when NJ-DOT financed improvements to the station, which resulted in the outer tracks being paved over, and 2 crumbling staircases were removed.

The book, "Jersey Central Lines in Color", has a number of pre and post Aldene plan pictures of CNJ trains making their PA station stop.

Today, on the street level near the station building, there is a historical marker that highlights this stations role, past and present.

Ken
peconicstation
 
Posts: 889
Joined: Mon Dec 13, 2004 8:17 am
Location: Boston, MA (Eastie)

Re: Perth Amboy High Level Platforms

Postby Rail Boy » Thu Jul 01, 2010 1:44 am

Well, IF NJT did decide to install a third track between River and Wood, it should have high speed crossovers, at least on the Wood end. While you don't want to slow the express down that you're trying to get around the local, you also don't want to slow every local down, since that is the bulk of the service. At the River end, this wouldn't be much of an issue since there is already the speed restriction on the bridge, 45mph IIRC.

The ideal situation would be to put the 3rd track on the outside of No. 2 track with an island platform between No. 2 and the new track (No. 4 for example sake). While most locals can stay on No. 2, they can still cross over to No. 4 if there is an express to get around.

I'll never forget the one time I rode 2394, the old weekend express from Bay Head to Hoboken that ran non stop from Long Branch to Newark. The local in front of us had some somewhere around Red Bank and we followed it on No. 2 all of the way from Middletown to Union. I remember the dispatcher called the train and said he has too much traffic on No. 1 and he can't get us around him anywhere. This was a Sunday mind you. Of course luck had it that No. 4 was OOS at South Amboy for the weekend.
Rail Boy
 
Posts: 282
Joined: Tue Jan 23, 2007 4:05 am
Location: Planet Earth

Re: Perth Amboy High Level Platforms

Postby Jtgshu » Thu Jul 01, 2010 8:19 am

Rail Boy wrote:Well, IF NJT did decide to install a third track between River and Wood, it should have high speed crossovers, at least on the Wood end. While you don't want to slow the express down that you're trying to get around the local, you also don't want to slow every local down, since that is the bulk of the service. At the River end, this wouldn't be much of an issue since there is already the speed restriction on the bridge, 45mph IIRC.

The ideal situation would be to put the 3rd track on the outside of No. 2 track with an island platform between No. 2 and the new track (No. 4 for example sake). While most locals can stay on No. 2, they can still cross over to No. 4 if there is an express to get around.

I'll never forget the one time I rode 2394, the old weekend express from Bay Head to Hoboken that ran non stop from Long Branch to Newark. The local in front of us had some somewhere around Red Bank and we followed it on No. 2 all of the way from Middletown to Union. I remember the dispatcher called the train and said he has too much traffic on No. 1 and he can't get us around him anywhere. This was a Sunday mind you. Of course luck had it that No. 4 was OOS at South Amboy for the weekend.


Exactly.....even track 4 in South Amboy was good for getting around locals. I remember doing that several times - the local would pull into track 4, make the station and the express (or X train) would zip by on track 2 while they were making their station stop - track 4 was only good for 25mph (and that was pushing it) so the train wasn't really delayed because by the time they got to Church's home signal, (now Essays new home signal for whatever reason) the other train had cleared up. Or the eastbound was put on 4, usually a SA local which was turning, a westbound on 1 and a westbound express on track 2, usually a 2300 train that first stop was Matawan.

There are a lot of "problems' with the way the signals are set up on the Coast Line which really prevent a lot of "'wrong way running" The only place that the disp will really let trains run around each other is inbetween East Matawan or Lloyd and Rare - every where else, its either too long of a stretch or Xover's too slow (Essay), and the way the trains are scheduled, especially on the weekends, thats the only place where another train is certain not to get bad signals.

The Coast Line can be mindnumbingly slow and tedious at times, especially with a dispatcher who won't "take chances"

High Speed Xovers wouldn't really be necessary near Perth Amboy - its only 35mph over River Draw, so standard 45mph Xovers would be fine, and at Wood, 60mph Xovers would be great, (as thats track speed through the area) but 45mph Xovers wouldn't be that bad either.
On the RR, "believe nothing you hear and only half of what you see"
John, aka "JTGSHU" passed away on August 26, 2013. We honor his memory and his devotion to railroading at railroad.net.
User avatar
Jtgshu
 
Posts: 11744
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 7:32 pm
Location: MP 39.1

Re: Perth Amboy High Level Platforms

Postby TheTroll » Fri Jul 02, 2010 7:06 am

Rail Boy wrote: At the River end, this wouldn't be much of an issue since there is already the speed restriction on the bridge, 45mph IIRC.



35 mph over River. :-D
TRADITION
Just because you've always done it that way doesn't mean it's not incredibly stupid.
TheTroll
 
Posts: 438
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2008 11:38 am
Location: The state of confusion

Re: Perth Amboy High Level Platforms

Postby OportRailfan » Fri Jul 02, 2010 8:19 am

TheTroll wrote:
Rail Boy wrote: At the River end, this wouldn't be much of an issue since there is already the speed restriction on the bridge, 45mph IIRC.



35 mph over River. :-D


That it is...

In my opinion, I think the best setup would be to add high levels on the outside of where current 1 track, and the old 4 track are. Clear out asphalt put in on top of track 4 so that 4 track could be used as a 'station siding' I guess, and let the current 2 track be the bypassfor expresses. Crossovers could be done at Wood and Essay. This limits the amount of track/catenary work needed to be done to the existing layout.

IINM, I also think there is catenary at one point over where the old track 4 is; it might not be in the station, but certain stretches would still need to be replaced/rehabbed.
Dock & Q: Last of a dying breed
User avatar
OportRailfan
 
Posts: 1825
Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2008 11:43 pm
Location: MP29.7

Re: Perth Amboy High Level Platforms

Postby OportRailfan » Mon Jun 27, 2011 1:50 pm

*Bump*

Surveyors were out in the vicinity of/in the station, and cars parked close to track 2.

Looked like they we're getting elevations for preliminary design work.
Dock & Q: Last of a dying breed
User avatar
OportRailfan
 
Posts: 1825
Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2008 11:43 pm
Location: MP29.7

Re: Perth Amboy High Level Platforms

Postby cruiser939 » Tue Jun 28, 2011 11:46 am

Very preliminary.
To loosely quote Capt. Jack Aubrey from the movie Master and Commander: "NJT runs a railroad, not a private yacht! WE DO NOT HAVE TIME FOR YOUR DAMNED HOBBIES, SIR!"

Originator of Jeff Smith rules!
Cruiser "Awesome Justice Train Freedom America" 939
User avatar
cruiser939
 
Posts: 4060
Joined: Fri May 14, 2004 3:15 pm
Location: Waiting 47 minutes at New Brunswick for my train

Re: Perth Amboy High Level Platforms

Postby Jtgshu » Tue Jun 28, 2011 12:39 pm

cruiser939 wrote:Very preliminary.


So there is still hope then for them to shift the platforms to the outside to leave room for a center third track through there maybe sometimes in future????? :)
On the RR, "believe nothing you hear and only half of what you see"
John, aka "JTGSHU" passed away on August 26, 2013. We honor his memory and his devotion to railroading at railroad.net.
User avatar
Jtgshu
 
Posts: 11744
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 7:32 pm
Location: MP 39.1

Re: Perth Amboy High Level Platforms

Postby cruiser939 » Tue Jun 28, 2011 12:55 pm

Jtgshu wrote:
cruiser939 wrote:Very preliminary.


So there is still hope then for them to shift the platforms to the outside to leave room for a center third track through there maybe sometimes in future????? :)

Yes, but only if rail ops ask for that to be done.
To loosely quote Capt. Jack Aubrey from the movie Master and Commander: "NJT runs a railroad, not a private yacht! WE DO NOT HAVE TIME FOR YOUR DAMNED HOBBIES, SIR!"

Originator of Jeff Smith rules!
Cruiser "Awesome Justice Train Freedom America" 939
User avatar
cruiser939
 
Posts: 4060
Joined: Fri May 14, 2004 3:15 pm
Location: Waiting 47 minutes at New Brunswick for my train

Re: Perth Amboy High Level Platforms

Postby michaelk » Tue Jun 28, 2011 2:21 pm

cruiser939 wrote:
Jtgshu wrote:
cruiser939 wrote:Very preliminary.


So there is still hope then for them to shift the platforms to the outside to leave room for a center third track through there maybe sometimes in future????? :)

Yes, but only if rail ops ask for that to be done.


is there a reason anyone is aware of that wouldn't always be a standard request-- dreaming of future expansion? Seems on the RVL they've built some of the newer platforms in the way.

Would the zigzag required into/out off the stations be a big deal or is it more that it's so unlikely to ever get used they figure why bother?

honestly I haven't paid that much attention- maybe on the RVL its so they can push the parking lots in and get more spaces? Perth Amboy that certainly wouldn't matter.

Actually makes me wonder- is the steel plant still running down there in Perth Amboy? Does their freight go up through the train station or south? There used to be a yard too I think off RARE in sayreville or old bridge- I think it was "brown's yard"? Does freight from there go north or south also?

I guess the question is does much freight traffic go up the NJCL there to towards Elizabeth port or no not really? If it does then I'd suppose a third track might even make sense now sort of like the gauntlet track in Roselle or Union?
michaelk
 
Posts: 434
Joined: Tue Jun 07, 2011 8:53 am

PreviousNext

Return to New Jersey Transit NJT Rail and Light Rail LRT

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests