NJT won't meet PTC Deadline

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Re: NJT won't meet PTC Deadline

Postby andrewjw » Wed Oct 03, 2018 9:53 am

Yeah, it looks like this:

Code: Select all
`-------->-------
        /
-------<---------


where < and > are switches and the bottom track is the southbound local track on the NEC, which is going southwest=leftward.

I asked the engineer when I was on board in the past few days and he said that the current plan is that they will not install PTC equipment on the Princeton branch trackage - though the Arrow MUs running on the branch will be PTC-capable.
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Re: NJT won't meet PTC Deadline

Postby Graeme Salt » Wed Oct 03, 2018 1:01 pm

Sort of relevant to this thread, but apologies if deemed an inappropriate question - can anyone advise whether (i) the top'n'tailing of passenger sets with two engines in lieu of cab cars oos for PTC equipment installation, and (ii) the use of non-revenue locomotives, are still going on? Or have the recent service reductions and temporary closure of the AC line removed the need?
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Re: NJT won't meet PTC Deadline

Postby EuroStar » Mon Nov 19, 2018 9:02 am

EuroStar wrote:As per NJT board presentation as of September 7:
131 pieces of equipment (read cab cars and engines) have PTC gear installed with 151 left to go
19 poles remain out of 111
27 antennas remain out of 111
21 wayside units remain out of 119
44 people need training out of 1305

PTC test area has been extended to between Denville andSummit (it had been between Denville and Morristown).

As per the October board meeting the status as of October 5th was:
165 pieces of equipment have PTC with 117 left to go
4 poles remain out of 111
18 antennas remain out of 111
9 wayside units remain out of 119
1 person left to train out of 1305
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Re: NJT won't meet PTC Deadline

Postby lensovet » Tue Nov 20, 2018 6:56 pm

that's not too bad though i suspect more cutbacks are going to be needed in january given how many units are still not equipped.
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Re: NJT won't meet PTC Deadline

Postby andrewjw » Tue Nov 20, 2018 7:57 pm

They equipped 34 more in September. Suppose they do the same in October, November, and December, then they will be down from 117 left to go, to 15 left to go. So they have a bit of leeway - so long as they have fewer than 34 left to go in January they will not need to make any more service cuts.
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Re: NJT won't meet PTC Deadline

Postby EuroStar » Wed Nov 21, 2018 3:58 pm

EuroStar wrote:
EuroStar wrote:As per NJT board presentation as of September 7:
131 pieces of equipment (read cab cars and engines) have PTC gear installed with 151 left to go
19 poles remain out of 111
27 antennas remain out of 111
21 wayside units remain out of 119
44 people need training out of 1305

PTC test area has been extended to between Denville andSummit (it had been between Denville and Morristown).

As per the October board meeting the status as of October 5th was:
165 pieces of equipment have PTC with 117 left to go
4 poles remain out of 111
18 antennas remain out of 111
9 wayside units remain out of 119
1 person left to train out of 1305


As of last week:
221 pieces of equipment have PTC with 61 left to go
5 antennas remain out of 111

I believe that these came out of the November board meeting and I have no official public source for these.
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Re: NJT won't meet PTC Deadline

Postby Defiant » Tue Nov 27, 2018 5:16 pm

So will NJT meet the PTC deadline or not? If all the equipment has PTC equipment installed? What about the actual railroad tracks?
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Re: NJT won't meet PTC Deadline

Postby andrewjw » Tue Nov 27, 2018 5:49 pm

Defiant wrote:So will NJT meet the PTC deadline or not? If all the equipment has PTC equipment installed? What about the actual railroad tracks?

The wayside units, antennas, and poles are the "railroad track" equipment. The rails themselves do not need to be altered.

It looks like they will make the deadline. As of Jan 1 they will be able to have all of the equipment which does not have PTC installed be out of service without having to further cut schedules.
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Re: NJT won't meet PTC Deadline

Postby Defiant » Thu Dec 06, 2018 12:28 pm

andrewjw wrote:
Defiant wrote:So will NJT meet the PTC deadline or not? If all the equipment has PTC equipment installed? What about the actual railroad tracks?

The wayside units, antennas, and poles are the "railroad track" equipment. The rails themselves do not need to be altered.

It looks like they will make the deadline. As of Jan 1 they will be able to have all of the equipment which does not have PTC installed be out of service without having to further cut schedules.



OK, but will they actually activate PTC system by 12/31/2018? When PATH actually turned on the system earlier this year, it was at first a disaster and caused a lot of delays... I shudder to think what would happen on NJT. Any idea what their plans for actually turning on and using the system are?
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Re: NJT won't meet PTC Deadline

Postby kilroy » Tue Dec 18, 2018 12:35 pm

Believe it our not, NJT made the 12/31 PTC deadline with time to spare.

NJ TRANSIT today marked 100-percent completion of the Federal Railroad Administration’s (FRA) 2018 year-end milestone for Positive Train Control (PTC). Criteria for this requirement included installation of equipment on locomotives and cab control cars, installation of 326 miles of wayside equipment including radios, transponders and poles, as well as initiating PTC testing and employee training. The achievement means NJ TRANSIT can apply for an alternative schedule to have PTC fully operational by the end of 2020.


https://www.njtransit.com/tm/tm_servlet.srv?hdnPageAction=PressReleaseTo&PRESS_RELEASE_ID=3262
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Re: NJT won't meet PTC Deadline

Postby DutchRailnut » Tue Dec 18, 2018 12:39 pm

read between lines they won't be 100% done , they will make deadline requirements.
they still need two years for completion and testing.

from article : PTC activities 2019-2020


Throughout the course of 2019 and 2020, NJ TRANSIT will continue to install PTC equipment as it continues to restore the ranks of locomotive engineers. PTC equipment will be installed on the remaining 158 locomotives and cab cars bringing the total number of vehicle installations to 440 by December 31, 2020. NJ TRANSIT will complete training of the remaining 985 employees bringing its total number of PTC trained employees to 2,730. Field testing will continue to demonstrate system reliability before advancing PTC testing to revenue service demonstration, interoperability and tenant railroad testing and full FRA PTC certification. Full PTC system implementation will occur by December 31, 2020.
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Re: NJT won't meet PTC Deadline

Postby CentralValleyRail » Tue Dec 18, 2018 3:36 pm

DutchRailnut wrote:read between lines they won't be 100% done , they will make deadline requirements.
they still need two years for completion and testing.

from article : PTC activities 2019-2020


Throughout the course of 2019 and 2020, NJ TRANSIT will continue to install PTC equipment as it continues to restore the ranks of locomotive engineers. PTC equipment will be installed on the remaining 158 locomotives and cab cars bringing the total number of vehicle installations to 440 by December 31, 2020. NJ TRANSIT will complete training of the remaining 985 employees bringing its total number of PTC trained employees to 2,730. Field testing will continue to demonstrate system reliability before advancing PTC testing to revenue service demonstration, interoperability and tenant railroad testing and full FRA PTC certification. Full PTC system implementation will occur by December 31, 2020.


Interesting I thought that something like 90% had to be done. 158 more to go is more like 60% done. Classic NJT claiming their done early.
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Re: NJT won't meet PTC Deadline

Postby EuroStar » Tue Dec 18, 2018 5:14 pm

The whole thing is absurd. The same day they announced that the conditions for the two year extension have been satisfied we cancelled 10+ trains due to lack of equipment (read equipment which needed repairs, inspections or simply was in the wrong part of the railroad). We are very far from having all necessary PTC stuff installed any time soon, much less having it operational. On paper the conditions for the FRA extension are satisfied, but the years of neglect under the previous governor will not be reversed by a 10 month blitz and still there is not enough money for maintenance. State of good repair continues to deteriorate, just not as fast as it used to.
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Re: NJT won't meet PTC Deadline

Postby Dcell » Sat Jan 05, 2019 9:13 am

Are this weeks train cancellations because of PTC problems. Governor Said PTC is completed. Is the system not working right?
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Re: NJT won't meet PTC Deadline

Postby DutchRailnut » Sat Jan 05, 2019 9:40 am

don't ever believe a governor, no its not complete, even NJT needed a 2 year waiver.
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