NJT HOBOKEN TERMINAL ACCIDENT THREAD

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Re: NJT HOBOKEN TERMINAL ACCIDENT THREAD

Postby litz » Mon Nov 14, 2016 4:23 pm

F40 wrote:Any "failure" of the brakes may come from any input failing to heed to the engineer's control (I am not sure how likely that is), not from the fail-safe mechanical mechanism of the brakes itself. If you have little to no pressure in the brake pipe or if the compressor was not making enough air and it drops below the threshold, this is akin to putting the train in emergency, and you will simply not go anywhere. Unless something miraculously caused the brakes to fall off from all the axles of the train, it will be generally very hard to blame it on the brakes. They should be tested as part of the thorough investigation, but I would not say it is such a "hot spot" to look for when listing possible causes of mechanical failure.


When was the last time there was an actual brake failure, either in freight or passenger service?

Excluding the runaway in Canada, which was human-caused, it's a very very very rare event.
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Re: NJT HOBOKEN TERMINAL ACCIDENT THREAD

Postby GirlOnTheTrain » Wed Nov 16, 2016 2:52 pm

glennk419 wrote:Are Tracks 5 & 6 still OOS?


I was there about a week and a half ago and they still were...quite fun since they were playing musical tracks with the train I was catching between 4 & 7 -_-
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Re: NJT HOBOKEN TERMINAL ACCIDENT THREAD

Postby lexon » Wed Nov 16, 2016 6:02 pm

Undiagnosed sleep apnea.

Google the sleep apnea.

It takes at least an over night sleep with sensors on the body and maybe even a camera. I am a Vet and the VA put a digital device on me with all kinds of sensors. I have a slight case of it. Stepson has it. A former boss had it. He could easily fall asleep in his office chair. Couple times I passed his house on way home from work and would see his car front up against the garage door and his brake lights on. Still in the car asleep. He mentioned to us it surprised him.

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Re: NJT HOBOKEN TERMINAL ACCIDENT THREAD

Postby Silverliner II » Wed Nov 16, 2016 11:21 pm

lexon wrote:Undiagnosed sleep apnea.


I am not surprised that this could have been a possibility. Not at all.

The engineer of a commuter train that slammed into a station going double the 10 mph speed limit, killing a woman, suffered from undiagnosed sleep apnea, his lawyer said Wednesday, and a U.S. official told The Associated Press that investigators are looking at it as a potential cause.


Full article:
http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/apne ... a-43589756
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Re: NJT HOBOKEN TERMINAL ACCIDENT THREAD

Postby MCL1981 » Thu Nov 17, 2016 8:18 am

Well that's the default answer to everything. And claimed only by his lawyer, not any actual fact from an actual investigation. It isn't a conclusion and hasn't been determined to be a cause. As such, I don't even believe it as a factor.
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Re: NJT HOBOKEN TERMINAL ACCIDENT THREAD

Postby DutchRailnut » Thu Nov 17, 2016 9:21 am

Plus the lawyer, with his case of premature oral ejaculation, has now probably been excluded from anymore NTSB meetings regarding his client.
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Re: NJT HOBOKEN TERMINAL ACCIDENT THREAD

Postby GirlOnTheTrain » Thu Nov 17, 2016 9:45 am

Did NJT ever take any precautions to screen engineers for sleep apnea following the results of Spuyten Duyvil or was that just an MTA undertaking?
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Re: NJT HOBOKEN TERMINAL ACCIDENT THREAD

Postby MCL1981 » Thu Nov 17, 2016 2:00 pm

Should they? Where do you draw the line? They don't screen pilots or any other profession I'm aware of. Many of which work way worse hours.
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Re: NJT HOBOKEN TERMINAL ACCIDENT THREAD

Postby GirlOnTheTrain » Thu Nov 17, 2016 2:52 pm

Wasn't implying that they should or shouldn't...merely inquiring. I believe people who were designated to be at risk with a certain neck circumference (as those who are overweight are more at risk to suffer from it) were screened at MN and NYCT...though people who actually work there can correct me if I heard wrong...wasn't sure if that ended up being an agency crackdown/CYA measure or a regional thing.

I.E. is the NTSB/FRA/ some other agency going to come back at NJT and say "Well Metro-North had an accident caused by previously undiagnosed sleep apnea, why did you not react to the findings and screen your engineers for the same?"
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Re: NJT HOBOKEN TERMINAL ACCIDENT THREAD

Postby Ken W2KB » Thu Nov 17, 2016 7:34 pm

MCL1981 wrote:Should they? Where do you draw the line? They don't screen pilots or any other profession I'm aware of. Many of which work way worse hours.
Seehttps://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/headquarters_offices/avs/offices/aam/ame/guide/dec_cons/disease_prot/osa/
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Re: NJT HOBOKEN TERMINAL ACCIDENT THREAD

Postby MCL1981 » Fri Nov 18, 2016 5:26 am

INteresting. Never knew that was of the medical for an ATP.
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Re: NJT HOBOKEN TERMINAL ACCIDENT THREAD

Postby F40 » Sat Nov 19, 2016 2:07 pm

litz wrote:
F40 wrote:Any "failure" of the brakes may come from any input failing to heed to the engineer's control (I am not sure how likely that is), not from the fail-safe mechanical mechanism of the brakes itself. If you have little to no pressure in the brake pipe or if the compressor was not making enough air and it drops below the threshold, this is akin to putting the train in emergency, and you will simply not go anywhere. Unless something miraculously caused the brakes to fall off from all the axles of the train, it will be generally very hard to blame it on the brakes. They should be tested as part of the thorough investigation, but I would not say it is such a "hot spot" to look for when listing possible causes of mechanical failure.


When was the last time there was an actual brake failure, either in freight or passenger service?

Excluding the runaway in Canada, which was human-caused, it's a very very very rare event.


Exactly my point as this seemed to keep surfacing as time went by.
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Re: NJT HOBOKEN TERMINAL ACCIDENT THREAD

Postby Ken W2KB » Sat Nov 19, 2016 7:58 pm

MCL1981 wrote:INteresting. Never knew that was of the medical for an ATP.


I think it was added only a couple or three years ago.
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Re: NJT HOBOKEN TERMINAL ACCIDENT THREAD

Postby John_Perkowski » Mon Nov 21, 2016 10:49 am

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Re: NJT HOBOKEN TERMINAL ACCIDENT THREAD

Postby DutchRailnut » Mon Nov 21, 2016 11:27 am

meanwhile in Canada they are finally reducing hours of service from 18 hours per day to 12 ?? go figure.
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