"Pocket Track" at Summit

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Re: "Pocket Track" at Summit

Postby time » Thu Jul 16, 2015 7:43 pm

Did anyone go the Morris Avenue bridge meeting on Wednesday? Just wondering if NJT mentioned anything about the pocket track project, since they'll likely conflict if done at the same time.
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Re: "Pocket Track" at Summit

Postby bleet » Fri Jul 17, 2015 3:53 pm

time wrote:Did anyone go the Morris Avenue bridge meeting on Wednesday? Just wondering if NJT mentioned anything about the pocket track project, since they'll likely conflict if done at the same time.


I did not go and have not seen any account of it. However, I don't see any conflict. If the pocket track and new interlocking are where everyone seems to think they'll be, that's a good 1/4 mile west of the bridge. Bridge work begins this month and NJT is just putting out bids on the track work this month -- allegedly -- so could be a while before that work even begins.
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Re: "Pocket Track" at Summit

Postby time » Thu Jul 23, 2015 10:21 pm

Is the $25 million for Summit Station in the 2016 Capital Budget a reference to the Pocket Track work, or is this part of some station improvements?
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Re: "Pocket Track" at Summit

Postby bleet » Fri Jul 24, 2015 1:38 pm

time wrote:Is the $25 million for Summit Station in the 2016 Capital Budget a reference to the Pocket Track work, or is this part of some station improvements?

No idea. I can't find any specific mention of Summit in the actual budget documents from either 2015 or 2016. The 'West Summit Interlocking' is the only actual project that I'm aware of. The station could use work -- they did actually put new stairs in for the island platform this spring -- but I don't know of anything else other than the need to repair the 'greenhouse' roof in above the waiting room which constantly leaks.

If the press release does describe the interlocking work perhaps that's to convince the riding public in Summit that a lot of money is being spent to benefit them and explaining that it's an 'interlocking' is more confusing than saying 'station'.
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Re: "Pocket Track" at Summit

Postby time » Sat Jul 25, 2015 8:50 am

$25 million seems like an awful lot of money to spend on a station that is otherwise functional and in good shape (my opinion, of course). I would have put that money toward Maplewood station--that station needs some help.

The platforms in Summit seem like they're relatively new, and look like they were recently restored. The station building itself is old, but does not appear to be in neglect. Perhaps it is to restore the actual building? Is there a waiting area inside the building that is not being used and needs restoration (not including the greenhouse)? I don't think I've ever actually been inside the building, other than using the stairwell to the greenhouse bridge.
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Re: "Pocket Track" at Summit

Postby nick11a » Sat Jul 25, 2015 8:58 am

time wrote:$25 million seems like an awful lot of money to spend on a station that is otherwise functional and in good shape (my opinion, of course). I would have put that money toward Maplewood station--that station needs some help.

The platforms in Summit seem like they're relatively new, and look like they were recently restored. The station building itself is old, but does not appear to be in neglect. Perhaps it is to restore the actual building? Is there a waiting area inside the building that is not being used and needs restoration (not including the greenhouse)? I don't think I've ever actually been inside the building, other than using the stairwell to the greenhouse bridge.


The platforms had work done not too long ago, yes, however the inside of Summit needs help. Parts of it look and smell like an out of date McDonald's bathroom.
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Re: "Pocket Track" at Summit

Postby time » Sat Jul 25, 2015 9:02 am

Hahahahahaha. The one in Times Square or Newark Penn Station?

Also, how do you get inside at Summit? I've never been, but often transfer and have a time to kill. If I need to use the restroom... Starbucks!
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Re: "Pocket Track" at Summit

Postby nick11a » Sat Jul 25, 2015 9:04 am

time wrote:Hahahahahaha. The one in Times Square or Newark Penn Station?

Also, how do you get inside at Summit? I've never been, but often transfer and have a layover. If I need to use the restroom... Starbucks!


Wait, one is better than the other? :-)
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Re: "Pocket Track" at Summit

Postby time » Sat Jul 25, 2015 9:06 am

The Times Square McDonalds is full of folks shooting up or throwing up (according to the New York Times). The Newark Penn Station McDonalds bathroom is probably well used by the Newark Penn Station residents.

I've never been in either, so... can't tell ya.
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Re: "Pocket Track" at Summit

Postby time » Wed Sep 06, 2017 6:48 pm

Bonehead checking in here. Any progress on this? The engineering work should be complete - shovels seem imminent.
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Re: "Pocket Track" at Summit

Postby lensovet » Mon Apr 02, 2018 1:14 am

time wrote:Bonehead checking in here. Any progress on this? The engineering work should be complete - shovels seem imminent.

curious minds want to know.

also whatever happened to the Morris Ave bridge?
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Re: "Pocket Track" at Summit

Postby time » Fri Apr 06, 2018 5:42 am

You can thank Christie for the delay on the Morris Ave bridge. It was an 18 month project, but the project was shuttered from July 2016 to November 2016 due to the transportation trust fund running out of money. Significant progress has been made in the past few months, and it is now projected to be complete by May.

From what I understand it was a difficult project, as there was a lot of city infrastructure tied into the project - like a major sewer main. Not to mention an active railway below.

Have not heard a peep on the pocket track.
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Re: "Pocket Track" at Summit

Postby lensovet » Sat Apr 07, 2018 11:37 pm

The sewer was just a drain sewer, but yeah that bridge looks like it's been built on top of and around time and time again. claustrophobic as hell too.

looks like May is already a further delay from where they thought they would be in late November, where the mayor says it should be done in April: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VY8L_oK8W2k. the city does have a construction updates page at https://www.cityofsummit.org/171/Construction-Updates which says May. I suspect any pocket track work would be posted there too.

btw whatever happened to the disintegrating retaining walls at the station? did those ultimately get properly fixed?
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Re: "Pocket Track" at Summit

Postby time » Tue Apr 10, 2018 7:09 pm

The "fix" for the Summit cut walls was to knock any loose concrete down. They also spray painted markings on the wall, and numbered (I assume a measurement) for what appears to be a longer term fix, or analysis for a longer term fix.

As for the Morris Ave bridge, there were utility complications as part of the project:

City Administrator Christopher Cotter said the state Department of Transportation has allotted $8.1 million for the project. “We don’t have at timeline, yet,” Cotter said, “as it’s a fairly complicated capital project.” Utilities, including a sewer line would be affected, as well as railroad tracks that serve Midtown Direct, detour routes and other factors.
http://www.nj.com/independentpress/inde ... is_av.html
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Re: "Pocket Track" at Summit

Postby time » Tue Apr 10, 2018 7:33 pm

It's frustrating that they have not mentioned this project at all in the past couple of years, but it could be one of those "quick wins" that NJT could tout as a project that will significantly enhance rail service for Morris & Essex and Gladstone riders - one of the most affected by the MidTown Direct "Summer of Hell" disruption. If you can't make the commute from Secaucus to NYP better, then do everything you can to make sure the rest of the trip goes without incident. Yet, even today, we're consistently getting delayed in summit on Dover trains for 5 minutes or more while we wait for "traffic to clear ahead." The delays are almost exclusively due to the operational issues around Summit station.

- Trains that turn around block the main line
- Longer EB trains using track 1 block access to WB trains attempting to crossover to the wall track, which then creates gridlock until the WB train clears.
- Bottleneck of three tracks constricting to two between Summit and Millburn

Everything would run much smoother if...

- Phase 1: Relocate Summit Yard to where the Gladstone and Morris & Essex lines split. Screw the pocket track ... move the entire yard there.
- Phase 1: Replace switches west of summit station with high speed crossovers.
- Phase 2: Extend the Track 1 and Wall track platform east, using the vacated yard space, to accommodate a 12 car train set. This would reduce dwell time in the station.
- Phase 2: Replace switches east of summit station with high speed crossovers.
- Phase 3: Add a third track between Millburn station and Summit Station

By year 2185 things will indeed be running very smooth. :P
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