Beacon Line Maintenance / Current Status / Background

Discussion relating to the operations of MTA MetroNorth Railroad including west of Hudson operations and discussion of CtDOT sponsored rail operations such as Shore Line East and the Springfield to New Haven Hartford Line

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Re: Beacon Line Maintenance / Current Status / Background

Postby Backshophoss » Wed Oct 19, 2016 1:58 am

Dutchess Jct was turned into CP 58 when NYC did away Signal station 50 in the '60's.
Over time NYC pulled up 2 mainlines turning a 4 track ROW into a 2 TRACK ROW.
This was a minor interchange between the NH and NYC.
Now under PC,the Beacon secondary became more useful after Poughkeepsie Bridge Burned.
I could never tell if there was a yard there,just the controlled siding,and the Beacon Secondary
heading east toward Hopewell Jct and the CTC controlled Maybrook Line after crossing the Hudson Mainlines on a bridge.
With the nearest shop at Harmon, a shuttle set would need to reverse(change ends) to get serviced if a Beacon-Hopewell shuttle was run.
With the Hopewell -Brewster North Shuttle,There's a running repair shop at Put Jct for servicing the shuttle set.
At one time there was wire to Danbury,from S Norwalk,that was removed ages ago by the NH,but left the cat poles behind to rust in place.
that why the local pols think it's easy to put back the wire. :P

Poughkeepsie was always a commuter layover yard,nothing else,except for a local freight based a small yard near the division post.
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Re: Beacon Line Maintenance / Current Status / Background

Postby Ridgefielder » Wed Oct 19, 2016 10:24 am

RussNelson wrote:You guys are being just amazingly impractical, with talk of electrification or reverse moves or flyovers or railbikes. What, are commuters going to ride railbikes down the Beacon Line to catch the train at the station?? No, the solution is simple: Put Dutchess Junction back into service. Then, a commuter train that's coming from the city and going to go up the Beacon Line comes off Metro North at Dutchess Junction, and heads up the Beacon Line. Then, you back down the Beacon Line, go over the Metro North line, back onto the siding here: https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/159543669 and pull forward, going into the city on the correct track. No fouling the main, ever.

It's easy to put Dutchess Junction back into play. There's nothing encroaching on the NYNH&H railbed. You just need two switches and two bridges. One is over Grandview Ave (https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/160294902) and the other is over Fishkill Creek(https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/160294901), and a new crossover track from the Beacon Station siding to the Metro North line going south.

Simple! Your problem is that you lack imagination! And a customer base!

I suppose I should know this, but- where was Dutchess Jct.? And what was it- the end of the ND&C or the NY&NE?
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Re: Beacon Line Maintenance / Current Status / Background

Postby DutchRailnut » Wed Oct 19, 2016 11:30 am

one thing everyone overlooks here is : MTA is not looking to provide any service.
MTA is looking for someone else to make money for them, but only on Beacon line from Beacon to Holmes.
any other operator can not operate on Metro North active tracks, union rules preclude that !
If Conductors are in charge, why are they promoted to be Engineer???

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Re: Beacon Line Maintenance / Current Status / Background

Postby RussNelson » Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:36 am

Ridgefielder wrote:I suppose I should know this, but- where was Dutchess Jct.? And what was it- the end of the ND&C or the NY&NE?

Dutchess Junction is on the USGS Topo maps. It's a placename rather a bit south of where the actual junction was. It's easy to find Dennings Point. It's um, Beacon's genital member. Well, trace the end of it over to the River Line, and that's where the ND&C used to interchange with the northbound track of the 'Central. It's gone. You need to be a ferroequinologist to find any trace of it. There is a flyover connecting to a siding off the southbound track of Metro-North. It also connects to a grown-over siding that goes up to the highway bridge over the tracks.

Long Dock Park used to be entirely coverd with tracks, and a five-stall roundhouse, with two (I think) car float docks that went across to Newburgh where (at least) the Erie also had a car float dock.

For the truly obscurant ferroequinologist, there were plans made, and grades graded, to terminate the Boston Hartford & Erie (predecessor to the ND&C) on Dennings Point. A bridge was constructed over the River LIne, and a trestle was begun to cross the bay to Denning's Point. Tracks were never laid, but you can still see the grading on Denning's Point.
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Re: Beacon Line Maintenance / Current Status / Background

Postby bigK » Sat Oct 22, 2016 9:03 am

Rail RFP: MTA METRO-NORTH RAILROAD REQUEST FOR EXPRESSIONS OF INTEREST - Beacon Line (Hudson Line Beacon to Holmes twn of Pawling Dutchess/Putnam border)

Questions about this RFEI should be addressed to Alicia Biggs at (212) 878-7148 or abiggs@mtahq.org.

DEADLINE:  Responses must be received by 3:00pm on Friday, November 18th, 2016.



MTA RFEI document (PDF) is available at my Trans Dutchess Rail site - also links to other documents and a video slide show about the Beacon Line

http://tdr.bigk12603.com/

if you are in he Poughkeepsie area next Thursday - there will be a Dutchess County PDCTC bike-ped advisory committee mtg. 3-5 PM at DCCC Bowne Hall rm 105 - on the agenda will be the Beacon Line - this will be the rail-with-trail aspect (like the Klara Sauer Trail Beacon and in Putnam) - contact me for more details
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Re: Beacon Line Maintenance / Current Status / Background

Postby Jeff Smith » Sat Oct 22, 2016 1:09 pm

This is what I was talking about: Google Maps/Beacon Line "Flyover"

Drag the map up to here: Google Maps/Beacon joins the Hudson. It comes in a ways up to the inbound track, then a switch to the outbound track at the same place. A little further up there's a siding, then the island platform at Beacon.

So, in theory, a cross-platform connection is possible. At that point, rather than reverse, why not just continue in revenue service to Poughkeepsie and connect with an Empire train (either direction)?

Before Dutch's head explodes, yes, this is pure foam. Just discussing possibilities.
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Re: Beacon Line Maintenance / Current Status / Background

Postby njt/mnrrbuff » Sat Oct 22, 2016 3:12 pm

That is very true about people who live in Pawling and Patterson driving to Southeast for more frequent service. It is basically like saying you live in Berkeley Heights and you will drive to Summit for more service. I know people who do that. Plus
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Re: Beacon Line Maintenance / Current Status / Background

Postby RussNelson » Sat Oct 22, 2016 3:58 pm

Jeff Smith wrote:Before Dutch's head explodes, yes, this is pure foam. Just discussing possibilities.


More foam: besides putting Dutchess Junction back in, you could also put Hopewell Junction back into service. Make a wye there so you can turn a train. Go up the ND&C track past the Hopewell Junction Depot and switch tower, and put the interchange track back in for the train to come around on it. Sure, there's junkyard there, but how much would it cost to buy them out? Since we're just foaming, we can imagine infinite revenue. Don't most foam designs assume infinite revenue?

And anyway, don't Dutchess Junction and Hopewell Junction deserve to be actual junctions??
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Re: Beacon Line Maintenance / Current Status / Background

Postby Jeff Smith » Sat Nov 05, 2016 3:00 pm

An addendum has been issued received via email. It is attached and summarized:

Public use exception to fair-use:

November 3, 2016
Re: Addendum #1 to Request For Expressions of Interest (RFEI) – Beacon Line
Dear Prospective Proposer:
Thank you for your interest in the above referenced RFEI.
1) A site tour/inspection has been scheduled for Thursday, November 10th, 2016 at 9:00 am. All those participating in the tour are asked to meet at 36 Railroad Avenue, Hopewell Junction in the parking lot adjacent to the former Hopewell Junction Station (now a museum). Please come equipped with a hard hat, vest, safety glasses and protective footwear. This personal protective equipment will not be provided and is mandatory. All site tour participants will be required to sign the attached PERMIT AND RELEASE TO VISIT RAILROAD FACILITIES attached below on page 4 of this Addendum #1.
Participation in the site tour/inspection is not required in order to submit a response to the RFEI.
2) The Deadline for responses to the RFEI is hereby extended to 3:00 p.m. on Wednesday, November 30, 2016.
3) A number of questions have been received pertaining to the Beacon Line, and are answered to the extent possible below. The questions, with the corresponding answers, are as follows:
Q.1 Are there any existing studies that have been done by MNR or municipal partners related to this potential rail line reactivation?
a. Beacon Line Feasibility Study; Frederic R. Harris, Inc., Metro-North Railroad – New York, NY – 2000. During this RFEI the executive summary will be provided upon request.
b. Rail Line Trolley Feasibility Study; KKO and Assoc., Andover, MA – 2003. Metro- North does not have this study.
Q.2 What is the current use of the line?
a. The only rail traffic in the past two years was the movement of two retired rail cars to the MTA Police Department facility. There has been no freight or revenue service for several years.
Q.3 How much of the current use must be preserved?
a. There is an underground fiber-optic cable route that must be maintained.
b. Any proposed use must be compatible with the MTA Police Department facility.
c. Existing Metro-North facilities, including but not limited to a training facility near Hopewell Junction (though this facility does not need to link directly with any other line including the Hudson and Harlem lines), and a headquarters for a maintenance of way drainage crew, also near Hopewell Junction.
d. Any existing bike path agreement(s) along the Line (Putnam and Dutchess County portion).
e. As stated in the RFEI, one of the goals of the proposal is to “preserve the line for current or future rail operation.”
Q.4 Is MNR the sole owner of this right-of-way?
a. Yes, subject to freight rights held by the Housatonic Railroad.
Q.5 Please provide a list of areas that do not meet FRA Class 1 inspection. Please also provide a copy of the most recent track inspection report for the line.
a. The entire line does not meet Class 1 inspection. There is no available track inspection report.
Q.6 Many of the RR crossings on the line look like they once had operating gates and flashers that seem to have been removed and placed in storage at some point. Are these gates and flashers available to be reinstalled at certain crossings?
a. The materials removed from the crossings are not available. They were obsolete and unusable.
Q.7 Please provide a copy of the most recent bridge inspection reports for all the bridges on the line that are large enough to be part of NYSDOT’s required annual inspection program.
a. The inspection reports are available but are too large to be attached here. Anyone wishing to view these reports may contact me directly.
Q.8 A request was made for a copy of the Valuation Maps for the line. Due to the size of the file, it cannot be attached here. Those who would like a copy of the Valuation Maps should contact me directly and I will email the files.
Remainder omitted


Some interesting stuff in here. Of course, we know the entire line is OOS. Interesting to see there was a study in 2000; not sure if I knew that or not. Some of the interest seems to be in rail operation, i.e. asking for crossing protection materials. So there has indeed been some interest. Good to see MNRR is doing its due diligence on the line. It may come to nothing, but at least we'll know.
Attachments
Addendum #1 to Request For Expressions of Interest - Beacon Line Opportunities.pdf
Addendum 1
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