Metro North Train Stations: Additional or Unnecessary?

Discussion relating to the operations of MTA MetroNorth Railroad including west of Hudson operations and discussion of CtDOT sponsored rail operations such as Shore Line East and the Springfield to New Haven Hartford Line

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Re: Unecessary Metro North Train Stations On The Harlem Line

Postby Ridgefielder » Mon Jun 18, 2018 12:07 pm

njt/mnrrbuff wrote:Closing Melrose and Tremont would be like closing Highland Ave Station on NJT's M&E. There are many people who live in the immediate area who probably reverse commute to jobs in like Summit and Morristown. Plus Highland Ave Station is extremely close to the West Orange Arts District.

If (when) I miss the 6:54 express from Bronxville in the morning I pick up the 6:59 local. Makes all stops to Grand Central including Tremont and Melrose. There are a lot of people de-training at those two stations inbound.

Yankee Stadium, the Bronx County courthouse complex and Lincoln Hospital are all within walking distance of Melrose Station. These are all significant employers. Tremont is likewise in the middle of a fairly significant little manufacturing/warehouse area.

They certainly aren't redundant even for peak-direction travel on weekdays.
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Re: Unecessary Metro North Train Stations On The Harlem Line

Postby Traingeek3629 » Mon Jun 18, 2018 1:08 pm

I'm actually surprised that Metro-North hasn't marketed taking the train to Melrose for Harlem line passengers as an alternative to connecting in Harlem. Melrose is on 162nd st, so it is one (small) block up Park Ave to 161st st, two blocks or so down is Yankee Stadium.
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Re: Unecessary Metro North Train Stations On The Harlem Line

Postby TCurtin » Mon Jun 18, 2018 1:31 pm

Earlier in this thread there's a mention of Oscawanna, Crugers, and Montrose. For those who don't know the Hudson Line, Metro North did a terrific piece of construction when they built one large, new station called "Cortlandt" with a lot of parking to replace all 3. The old stations were on not-particularly-accessible back roads and were little old "rabbit hutch" stops with virtually no parking. My wife and I use it all the time whenever we go into the city since we moved to the area in 2016.

The only nostalgia i have for old Oscawanna station is that the pedestrian bridge crossing the tracks there was a fabulous,extremely scenic photo spot for Albany-bound trains as they gathered speed coming toward you on the long tangent..

Funny, I have some commuting neighbors who --- no matter how good the service to and from Cortlandt is --- doggedly insist on driving the extra 4 miles to Harmon and paying the highway robbery parking rates there "because there are more trains." This is an odd commentary on the commuter brain. It does not seem to have occurred to them that the "more trains" are all the locals that you wouldn't want to take (Well, I wouldn't want to.....). The same express you can get at Harmon you can get at Cortlandt, with cheaper parking and closer to home!! My wife explains that as " the people want to walk into GCT at the end of the day and just plop down on anything that's departing in a couple of minutes without regard to how many stops it makes."
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Re: Unecessary Metro North Train Stations On The Harlem Line

Postby njt/mnrrbuff » Mon Jun 18, 2018 3:51 pm

Cortlandt Station is excellent. It was a great idea for mta to merge both Crugers and Montrose since the access to them was poor. They weren’t true stations. Cortlandt is a true station with a lot of parking and very good express service. Many of the trains that serve Croton Harmon are locals.
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Re: Unecessary Metro North Train Stations On The Harlem Line

Postby Traingeek3629 » Mon Jun 18, 2018 8:01 pm

On the New Haven Line, I was staying at the Stamford Marriott and went into the city. Leaving Grand Central, I chose a local to Stamford over an express for one major reason: The NH train was 85% full with 3 minutes until departure. The Stamford train left only two-thirds full, leaving the bathroom lines low and it gave us plenty of room and time to relax and stretch out with out 6 people waiting in the aisle for a restroom or 4 people cramming into a row of 3. In the summer, Hudson Line trains for Poughkeepsie tend to be packed, whereas the Croton trains have a light load as they serve mostly commuters.
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Re: Lost Station

Postby PC1100 » Wed Jun 27, 2018 12:44 am

Union Tpke wrote:I know that this is old, but do you know anything else about the plan to discontinue service at Wakefield?


I'm not 100% sure about the plan Noel mentioned which would have been 1973 (when Morrisania and 183rd St. closed), but there was a plan to close it back in 1953 when a huge fire broke out there and destroyed the platforms. The NY Central decided to rebuild it, so if there was a plan 20 years later to close it with the high levels it's a rare case!
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Re: Unecessary Metro North Train Stations

Postby R36 Combine Coach » Sat Jun 30, 2018 6:41 pm

Traingeek3629 wrote:Ludlow has low ridership, same with the Heights stations (especially University)
Reverse travel outbound seems common at University Heights.
Since my friend continues to chain smoke nonstop, she is probably an Alco.
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Re: Unnecessary Metro North Train Stations

Postby trainbrain » Fri Jul 06, 2018 10:09 pm

With regard to the post about Cortlandt vs Croton Harmon. Cortlandt has a LAZ operated parking facility that charges 4 dollars for 16 hours. Croton Harmon has a town operated facility that charges 10 dollars a day. Croton Harom is ridiculously overpriced for a park and ride station and is probably the most expensive in all of Metro North.

Croton Harmon gets many more trains than Cortlandt obviously. All trains stop there except the super express trips that go all the way to Beacon and the locals that short turn further south. Cortlandt only has the diesel trains that don't go nonstop to Beacon. Most of the peak hour Croton Harmon trains are semi express. Obviously slower than the regular (not super) express trains from Poughkeepsie that you could get at Cortlandt.

The advantage of getting on at an early stop is that you get the pick of the litter with seats. The advantage of getting on at a later stop is that you get to choose who you sit near (rather than them choosing for you), and shorter travel time.

Even with those factors I'd say Cortlandt is the better option. 6 dollars extra per day in parking adds up fast. Also, the best trains at Croton Harmon are the same ones that also serve Cortlandt.
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Re: Unnecessary Metro North Train Stations

Postby njt/mnrrbuff » Sat Jul 07, 2018 7:37 am

Metro North structures there service patterns great that there is good express service at many stations, enabling you to get a seat, even if you board a train at one of the last stations in that zone before it runs express. Cortlandt is a great station. It sounds like it is too expensive to part at Croton-Harmon.
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Re: Unnecessary Metro North Train Stations

Postby Paul1705 » Sat Jul 07, 2018 8:29 pm

The Bronx is getting more development recently, so that might change the transportation picture.

https://ny.curbed.com/maps/south-bronx-new-york-construction-map

Melrose looks like it is well-placed to take advantage of the new developments, although the station itself should be expanded. The area around it is already dramatically different from the way it was ten years ago.
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Re: Unnecessary Metro North Train Stations

Postby truck6018 » Sun Jul 08, 2018 2:57 pm

trainbrain wrote:Even with those factors I'd say Cortlandt is the better option. 6 dollars extra per day in parking adds up fast. Also, the best trains at Croton Harmon are the same ones that also serve Cortlandt.


Granted $6 a day adds up, you have to take into account the difference in fare between Cortlandt and Croton-Harmon. During peak time, Croton-Harmon to GCT is $14 each way, Cortlandt to GCT $16.75 each way. Round trip calculates to $5.50 difference more to travel to Cortlandt. With this said, in reality, you're only saving 50 cents. In my opinion, paying the extra half dollar is worth the convenience of more service to Croton-Harmon over Cortlandt.
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Re: Unnecessary Metro North Train Stations

Postby mkm4 » Mon Jul 09, 2018 11:22 am

No the reality is that you'd be using a monthly or weekly ticket and that you should get a parking permit for Cortlandt. With the 16 hour parking permit you'r paying under $1.75 per day to park there. At Croton-Harmon, there is a wait list for permits and they still cost almost three time as much for a non-resident.
So the savings is closer to $4.00 per day, if you commute everyday and have a permit.
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Re: Unnecessary Metro North Train Stations

Postby Jeff Smith » Wed Oct 24, 2018 12:39 pm

If anything, MNRR has been ADDING stations, including as GirlOnTheTrain has noted, reopening them. I'm going to have some fun, and expand the topic to include stations that may be needed.
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Re: Metro North Train Stations: Additional or Unnecessary?

Postby Jeff Smith » Wed Oct 24, 2018 12:49 pm

Additional stations may also be capacity driven. Is there enough equipment and headways available? Once MNRR has MLV's for push-pull, it's possible.

There should be four additional stations in the East Bronx for Penn Station Access after ESA finally opens.

There have been proposals in CT for a station on the New Canaan line where it crosses US1 in East Stamford. I'd list that as a long shot.

Similarly, Bridgeport and some state officials want a Barnum station in East Bridgeport. Better would be a transfer station at Devon.

I can't remember, but has a station opened up in Orange, CT? That would be in addition to Fairfield Metro, and West Haven, which opened in the last 10 years or so.
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Re: Metro North Train Stations: Additional or Unnecessary?

Postby Traingeek3629 » Wed Oct 24, 2018 7:48 pm

Stations in Orange, and East Bridgeport (Barnum Station) have been proposed. The Barnum one is supposed to have two island platforms and possibly replace Bridgeport as Bridgeports main Amtrak station, with buses to downtown. I personally hate that idea, but it is out there.

On another note, the East Bronx service has been delayed (again)
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