MN nose hatch and the tunnels

Discussion relating to the operations of MTA MetroNorth Railroad including west of Hudson operations and discussion of CtDOT sponsored rail operations such as Shore Line East and the Springfield to New Haven Hartford Line

Moderators: GirlOnTheTrain, nomis, Jeff Smith, FL9AC

P32AC-DM - hatch at the nose ???

Postby .Taurus. » Sun Jul 30, 2006 5:31 pm

Hello!
Is the hatch at the nose of the P32AC-DM an emergency exit ?? (above the headlight)
A special need to opertate in tunnels?
>> Pic <<

Greets
User avatar
.Taurus.
 
Posts: 172
Joined: Mon Apr 17, 2006 4:53 pm
Location: Germany

Postby DutchRailnut » Sun Jul 30, 2006 5:51 pm

Yes due to park avenue tunnel MNCR had to get emergency hatch for engineer to be able to escape incase of fire.
When your sitting on top of 2200 gallons of fuel with most likely place of fire being tanks or engine room there was no way to get out.
Amtrak P32acdm's do not have the hatch cause their tunnels have a sidewalk for engineer to escape.
In Park Avenue tunnel there is only a foot of room on sides (at places )and if flames are coming on sides that escape route is blocked.
If Conductors are in charge, why are they promoted to be Engineer???

Retired Triebfahrzeugführer. I am not a moderator.
User avatar
DutchRailnut
 
Posts: 22137
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 8:02 pm
Location: released from Stalag 13

Postby .Taurus. » Sun Jul 30, 2006 6:46 pm

Is there a rope or ladder mounted at the inside of the hatch or somewhere else to leave the engine without falling ~10ft down?
Greets
User avatar
.Taurus.
 
Posts: 172
Joined: Mon Apr 17, 2006 4:53 pm
Location: Germany

Postby Penn Central » Sun Jul 30, 2006 6:48 pm

When the nose door is opened, there is a ladder that folds down.
Here's an old picture from an emergency evacuation class
that shows how the door is used.
Image
User avatar
Penn Central
 
Posts: 467
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2004 8:19 pm

Postby DutchRailnut » Sun Jul 30, 2006 6:53 pm

There is fold up ladder and knotted rope to hold onto.
Despite it looking small, the opening in nose is same as screen opening under control stand and same size as regulation escape hatch as per USAF specifications. even I with my slightly large frame can get out in less than 1.5 minutes.
If Conductors are in charge, why are they promoted to be Engineer???

Retired Triebfahrzeugführer. I am not a moderator.
User avatar
DutchRailnut
 
Posts: 22137
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 8:02 pm
Location: released from Stalag 13

Postby .Taurus. » Sun Jul 30, 2006 7:01 pm

Thx a lot :-D
User avatar
.Taurus.
 
Posts: 172
Joined: Mon Apr 17, 2006 4:53 pm
Location: Germany

Postby Stephen B. Carey » Sun Jul 30, 2006 7:07 pm

I always thought that the hatch was for sand, because Amtrak has two little hatches on either side underneath the winshield wipers. Anyone have a picture of the hatch from the cab??
Stephen B. Carey
 
Posts: 330
Joined: Wed Feb 09, 2005 10:29 pm
Location: Hartford, CT

Postby Nasadowsk » Sun Jul 30, 2006 7:17 pm

This begs the question - is there anyone (hypothetically) at MN who *can't* fit through it? Would that hypothetical person be restricted from running the equipment as a result?
Nasadowsk
 
Posts: 3976
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 10:45 pm

Postby DutchRailnut » Sun Jul 30, 2006 7:44 pm

The sand hatches on both Amtrak and MNCR P32acdm's are on side, just around corner from marker lights, the hatch under it is to clean sand trap and to fill windshield wiper fluid.
The location was moved from Amtrak P40 plans so sand can be put in at small platforms in yards.
The P40's have sand hatches on front of engine and therefore can not be sanded in the outlying yards. This will be fun again this fall.

Phil If my slightly large frame can get tru anyone can get tru.

The Emergency hatch is not visible in the cab , its behind a screen under the control desk and a door that give acces to the nose compartment.
If Conductors are in charge, why are they promoted to be Engineer???

Retired Triebfahrzeugführer. I am not a moderator.
User avatar
DutchRailnut
 
Posts: 22137
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 8:02 pm
Location: released from Stalag 13

Postby Stephen B. Carey » Sun Jul 30, 2006 9:47 pm

Thanks Dutch
Stephen B. Carey
 
Posts: 330
Joined: Wed Feb 09, 2005 10:29 pm
Location: Hartford, CT

Postby keotaman » Mon Jul 31, 2006 3:16 am

Nasadowsk wrote:This begs the question - is there anyone (hypothetically) at MN who *can't* fit through it? Would that hypothetical person be restricted from running the equipment as a result?


Who knows? When qualifying, we were NOT allowed to open the hatch! Seems like a good suit just waiting to happen.
Codger, Retired
User avatar
keotaman
 
Posts: 125
Joined: Sun Jun 11, 2006 1:43 pm
Location: CT

Postby DutchRailnut » Mon Jul 31, 2006 6:58 am

Reason for not opening hatch is , if you lower/drop hatch it breaks the headlight glass and renders the locomotive inoperable due to defects. and that hatch is very heavy so 9 out 10 times the peron opening hatch drops it.
If Conductors are in charge, why are they promoted to be Engineer???

Retired Triebfahrzeugführer. I am not a moderator.
User avatar
DutchRailnut
 
Posts: 22137
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 8:02 pm
Location: released from Stalag 13

Postby Clean Cab » Mon Jul 31, 2006 9:21 am

I feel for any engineer who ever has to use that escape hatch in the event of a real fire in the Park Ave Tunnel!! By the time you remove the large part of the dashboard, crawl inside the nose, unlatch the hatch, extend the mini ladder, push the rope outside and shimmy down the rope, you'd be overcome by smoke and propably be not too coherent.

When you are panicing, easy things become quite difficult.
I'm stuck on a sandbar on Cape Cod, and I couldn't be happier!!!
Clean Cab
 
Posts: 2893
Joined: Tue Oct 25, 2005 4:18 pm
Location: South Dennis Massachusetts

Postby Penn Central » Mon Jul 31, 2006 2:12 pm

DutchRailnut wrote:Reason for not opening hatch is , if you lower/drop hatch it breaks the headlight glass and renders the locomotive inoperable due to defects. and that hatch is very heavy so 9 out 10 times the peron opening hatch drops it.


Despite using a 2x4 to protect it, I broke the headlight cover when I made the demonstration pictured above. The Harmon Shop Supt. was not very happy. The entire procedure was videotaped and that film is now used for training. There are very few places in the tunnel where the front hatch would be needed, and that is only on the outside tracks (3 and 4). I never heard of an engineer going through the nose of an FL-9 to escape a fire behind them, so it is extremely unlikely that the nose door on the Genesis would ever be needed. Instructions for engineers tell them to take the train out of the tunnel whenever possible, heading north. In the event that could not be done, they can stop at an emergency exit. The nose door would only be an egress of last resort.
User avatar
Penn Central
 
Posts: 467
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2004 8:19 pm

Postby The RailMan » Mon Jul 31, 2006 5:56 pm

Has the emergency egress hatch ever been used in a real emergency situation?
The RailMan
 

Next

Return to MTA Metro-North Railroad and CtDOT Passenger Rail

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests