The T is absolutely beautiful and boast worthy for Boston.

Discussion relating to commuter rail, light rail, and subway operations of the MBTA.

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Postby efin98 » Fri Jan 14, 2005 7:39 pm

hebron_hapt wrote:The title of this thread is laughable!

I don't necessarily knock the T for what it is, but for what it could be save for a bad attitude among some of its employees and managers, as well as some riders. Other entities do more with less. It costs nothing to pick up a newspaper off a seat and deposit it in a proper receptacle. The system lacks pride, and it sorely shows. But, pride isn't a commodity valued by many Bostonians when it comes to their public facilities.


Based on what? What other systems have you ridden on to make that claim? Seriously, you fling accusations but have not backed it up, only attacked others for not agreeing with you.
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Postby hebron_hapt » Fri Jan 14, 2005 8:12 pm

You are very sensitive sir. If I come across as attacking anyone I am sorry.

I ride subways in NYC, Philly, Wash DC, Baltimore, Montreal and Toronto on a fairly regular basis. I ride CTA when business brings me to Chicago. All fare better than the T when it comes to the combination of attitude, cleanliness and signage. Yes, even NYC is friendlier. And cleaner, on the whole. It's old, but I didn't smell urine once in my subway rides down there. In Boston it's common.

Boston's T is a drag. I ride it only because I have to. And I love trains...
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Postby CSX Conductor » Fri Jan 14, 2005 8:21 pm

ST214 wrote:The least the T can do is have the operator walk thru the train with a trashbag at the end of the line and gather up the big stuff, instead of letting it just wander on the floor. How much would that cost??? Are trash bags THAT expensive???


The problem here is not cost, but more so a labor agreement problem. I wouldn't be suprised if the MBTA's motorman's union fought agains that one, after-all, the T has Uni-Source for cleaning the stations, they should be doing the trains as well. The motormen & guards are not getting paid to clean the trains that they are paid to operate.
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Postby ST214 » Fri Jan 14, 2005 9:44 pm

CSX, yes, i forgot about UNICO. Maybe teh T should look into them as they are not doing their job.


hebron_hapt= Yes i agree the urine smell is all too common. The elevators at Park St always smell like urine, and last time i was in Framingham, one elevator had a strong smell of urine and a puddle on the floor, and the other had a sign placed by the state on the inside saying that the elevator was unsafe. By the way, are you Paul Appolo(sp)???
Hoping for a rebirth of the Screamer fleet.
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Postby efin98 » Fri Jan 14, 2005 10:35 pm

hebron_hapt wrote:I ride subways in NYC, Philly, Wash DC, Baltimore, Montreal and Toronto on a fairly regular basis. I ride CTA when business brings me to Chicago. All fare better than the T when it comes to the combination of attitude, cleanliness and signage. Yes, even NYC is friendlier.


Bogus. Boston has it's jerks and it's a-holes but I've had more trouble down in New York and Toronto with motormen and conductors than I have ever had in Boston. And the signage? If people bothered to READ the signs and not assume they know what they are doing then they would have no problem with Boston. In my not so humble opinion, New York has the worst signage out of all of the stations. Simply the worst at directing you where the exits are and which platforms you need to go to to wait for your trains.

And cleaner, on the whole. It's old, but I didn't smell urine once in my subway rides down there. In Boston it's common.


BS. Utter BS. I've been on elevators on all the lines at various points in the system and only encounter problems at Downtown Crossing and Beachmont- one due to heavy usage and the other due to it being out of service for repairs for a while(can't get at the inside, can't clean).

Boston's T is a drag. I ride it only because I have to. And I love trains...


I guess that sums up your point- you generalize because you are too biassed to even bother to ride.
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Postby hebron_hapt » Sat Jan 15, 2005 12:33 am

Oh, I ride. All too often. That's the problem. I find myself WANTING to ride less and less.

Fortunately, I live and work in Maine now, so when I come down I'm choosing more and more to drive. A real shame. If the T can't attract a train lover out of his car, it's broken.
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Postby GP40MC 1116 » Sat Jan 15, 2005 1:28 pm

I have been riding the T for close to 15 or so years now, ever since iwwas 2-3 years old w my parents and aunts til now im 18 and I roam arround this system quite a bit. And I can say that i never have had many problems with it since i started using it. It's a good system, and has good history with it, every transit system has it's problems, $$ and everything else take time to get. All and all it's a good system and i like riding on it alot
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Postby trolleyguy » Sat Jan 15, 2005 4:19 pm

Efin98 - You appear to be very strongly defending the current conditions on the T - certainly more so than open to suggestions that it can or ought to be improved.

You impress me as someone who either:

1), is truly blind to the way things really are or,

2), is able to see things perfectly clearly but really likes the T the way it is and wants no changes or improvements made to it, and surely no criticism of it or,

3), is very cynical and bitter, and who has given up hope that things can ever be better, and doen't want to hear anything more about it or.

4) a combination of the above.

Are you sincerely telling us that the status-quo is the best that we can expect of the MBTA, and that we should simply lie back and accept it the way it is and get on with our lives?

To me anyway, these are the messages that keep coming from your postings on this topic.

Am I being fair in my assessment of what you are saying?
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Postby MBTA1 » Sat Jan 15, 2005 4:45 pm

Its funny that if somebody supports the MBTA the way it is they are attacked viciously, and Mike Mulhern is always being put down as a bad leader, but nobody here has any experience (at least to my knowlage) of running one of the largest public transit authorities in the United States. I'm willing to bet that only a handful of people on this website could run the T any better than he's trying.
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Postby efin98 » Sat Jan 15, 2005 8:58 pm

trolleyguy wrote:Efin98 - You appear to be very strongly defending the current conditions on the T - certainly more so than open to suggestions that it can or ought to be improved.

You impress me as someone who either:

1), is truly blind to the way things really are or,


I see more than enough, I ride it often enough through one of the most transit deprived municipalities in the T system

2), is able to see things perfectly clearly but really likes the T the way it is and wants no changes or improvements made to it, and surely no criticism of it or,


I see things clearly and can see where changes are clearly needed(see allusion above) but I defend when there is a clear case of unneccessary crticism

3), is very cynical and bitter, and who has given up hope that things can ever be better, and doen't want to hear anything more about it or.


It works both ways, I seem that way compared to people who have only has not ridden over all parts of the system during all times of the day and night and/or are so blinded with their hatred that they will not hear anything but those that agree with them

Are you sincerely telling us that the status-quo is the best that we can expect of the MBTA, and that we should simply lie back and accept it the way it is and get on with our lives?


I didn't say that, don't put words in my mouth. I was stating that take a closer look before you speak because what was stated is not what is really there. There are more to be seen than what was seen.

To me anyway, these are the messages that keep coming from your postings on this topic.

Am I being fair in my assessment of what you are saying?


No. You are new here and don't know the members all that well so I'll make it clear: I am the most stubborn person on this forum but I will defend those who are being wronged when I see it. I am steadfast in my opinions and do not hold back because it offends anyone. Defending the T is not something I do all the time, this just happens to be a time when the T needed defending.
efin98
 

Postby SnoozerZ49 » Sat Jan 15, 2005 9:02 pm

I'd suggest that efin, you need to take it down a notch :wink: Don't fall in to a trap that I have fallen into. It is harder to make your point when it sounds like you are "going wackadoo" on people that disagree with you :(

To the point of the T, it is a disgrace, but I think it has a lot more to do with the fact that a lot of people act in a very irresponsible manner. Also public trtansportation is a haven for a large number of homeless, destitute and menatlly ill people. I know, I have to deal with them every day. A bit off topic but our society chooses to leave these people out in the cold, literally. Yes some choose to be homeless, but many of them also face serious mental illness or addictions. The T whether we like it or not is a place to get out of the cold.

Another problem is the conduct of some people when they are drunk or under the influence of a drug. They are prone to cause disruptions, vandalism and also contribute to the mess on trains and buses. Every single train I am on has at least one drunk or "high" person.

Others are "ferral" humans that have no understanding of what it means to be responsible either in terms of how they treat other people or how they dispose of their trash, urine or whatever.

The T is certainly not a perfect agency, far from it but we should wake up to the fact that the T cleans its cars, buses and coaches each night, ride the first trip of the day on my train and you will find it clean. The trash does not simply appear from nowhere!

One day a huffy business man angrily asked me when the last time I had cleaned the toilet! How do I answer that one, first of all Conductors don't generally clean toilets and secondly we aren't the ones that mess them up!

This is a valid topic, but comparing us to other cities should also include comparing the public behavior of our citizens. Toronto's subways are clean in part due to the diligence of its citizens.
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Postby efin98 » Sat Jan 15, 2005 9:09 pm

SnoozerZ49 wrote:I'd suggest that efin, you need to take it down a notch :wink: Don't fall in to a trap that I have fallen into. It is harder to make your point when it sounds like you are "going wackadoo" on people that disagree with you :(


Not happening, if people think what I said is bad then they need to accept they are going to get the same criticism when they dish it out. My point was clear, if they don't like it too bad.
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Moderatour's notice

Postby Robert Paniagua » Sat Jan 15, 2005 10:34 pm

MODERATOUR'S NOTICE

Ok getnts, looks like this conversation has started to "cross the line" here, so.................

................THAT'S ALL FOLKS!!

Se acabo.
~Robert Paniagua
Moderator: WMATA :: General Railroad Operations
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