Simple Question about the T and its badness

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Simple Question about the T and its badness

Postby jumbotusk » Mon Oct 18, 2004 10:53 am

Ok... simple question....

Why is the T just bad? (service, moderness, cleaness, speed, reliability)

New York isn't that much more expensive and is insanely efficient. DC is amazing, but costs more (but well worth it).

Does the T just not have the rider volume to get the economies of scale that NY can achieve? Or is the T going to be eternally slow, old and unreliable?

Is this a case of you truely get what you pay for? What exactly is the extra 25 cent increase going to cover anyhow? what exactly are the service improvements?

I think the extra 25 cents is not to improve service, but rather cover increased costs of maintaining the status quo. Costs are going up because the T is poorly managed.
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Postby Robert Paniagua » Mon Oct 18, 2004 10:54 am

Only the planned new Green Line opening has happened, nothing else new since, and I guess that you could say that service has been the same over the past 15 or so years I'm afraid..........
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Postby Cotuit » Mon Oct 18, 2004 11:20 am

Robert Paniagua wrote:Only the planned new Green Line opening has happened, nothing else new since, and I guess that you could say that service has been the same over the past 15 or so years I'm afraid..........


Yes, in the last 15 years none of the blue line stations have been renovated. Nothing has been done about the stations on the Ashmont branch. No new cars have been bought for the green line. No new cars have been bought for the red line. Nothing has been done about accessability on the green line. No stations have been added to the commuter rail system. The Old Colony lines still lie unused...

Please, I've lived in Boston and New York. One train breaks down in New York and the entire system goes into chaos. The buses in the outer boroughs suck. I could go on.

Or ask a Philadelphian what they think about the T as compared to SEPTA.

The T may not be perfect, and there is a lot that could be done to improve it, but it is still one of the top transit systems in North America, and a bargain at that.
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Postby CRail » Mon Oct 18, 2004 11:47 am

T has lousy management and is undergoing a lot of modernizing projects which can make your commute a nightmare.

There are many major projects underway:

Red Line:
South Station Reconstruction
Charles/MGH reconstruction
Ashmont line work

Green Line:
Superstation
Elevated demolition

blue line
bowdoin restoration
new heavy rail cars
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Postby Robert Paniagua » Mon Oct 18, 2004 12:04 pm

That's right, it is causing some commuting problems with all those construction problems.
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Postby Ron Newman » Mon Oct 18, 2004 12:11 pm

CRail wrote:bowdoin restoration


huh?
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Postby MBTA F40PH-2C 1050 » Mon Oct 18, 2004 1:24 pm

Cotuit, there are the new Type 8's that the MBTA bought for the green line, although they are not in full service, but they are fairly new
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Postby Cotuit » Mon Oct 18, 2004 1:41 pm

MBTA F40PH-2C 1050 wrote:Cotuit, there are the new Type 8's that the MBTA bought for the green line, although they are not in full service, but they are fairly new


I was being sarcastic, everything I said didn't happen actually has. It was a response to the claim that the T has been the same for the last 15 years.
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Postby Robert Paniagua » Mon Oct 18, 2004 1:43 pm

Yeah I agree with how the T has been the same in the last 15-20 years, even though they redid some stations over while they are currently doing so, and they got new car orders or are getting them now.
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Postby fm535 » Mon Oct 18, 2004 5:13 pm

I think the T is just typical...nothing better about it or nothing worse. It's communication system sucks, its need to modernize management is phenomenal, but there are probably pro's and con's that would fill many pages here that you could compare with NYC, Philly, DC, Chicago, etc.

Example: Fairly good notification about the Red Line bustitution this past weekend. The newspapers had clips on it, and the stations were posted. It never happened! I ended up at work 45 minutes early, because I left an extra 20 minutes to allow for the bus connections, and it never happened. But we can bitch and moan about it, and you can find similar elsewhere.

As a friend said to me the other day: Build a bridge, and GET OVER IT!
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In defense of the T

Postby CS » Mon Oct 18, 2004 6:15 pm

The T does have it downfalls, but you cannot honestly say that the T has done nothing in the last 15 years. 01800's, Breda's, the huge Ashmont renovations and etc...

And alot of people point out that we have gotten nothing out of the fare increase (let alone Ashmont renovations, North Station, Breda's, CNG's, Silver Line Phase 1 and 2, Airport Station, and more that I can't get off the top of my head), the reason why the T raised the fares is because it had no money - if they didn't raise it, they would have to cut service.

Would you rather see cut service?
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Postby ctaman34 » Mon Oct 18, 2004 7:42 pm

Cotuit wrote:
Robert Paniagua wrote:Only the planned new Green Line opening has happened, nothing else new since, and I guess that you could say that service has been the same over the past 15 or so years I'm afraid..........


Yes, in the last 15 years none of the blue line stations have been renovated. Nothing has been done about the stations on the Ashmont branch. No new cars have been bought for the green line. No new cars have been bought for the red line. Nothing has been done about accessability on the green line. No stations have been added to the commuter rail system. The Old Colony lines still lie unused...

Please, I've lived in Boston and New York. One train breaks down in New York and the entire system goes into chaos. The buses in the outer boroughs suck. I could go on.

Or ask a Philadelphian what they think about the T as compared to SEPTA.

The T may not be perfect, and there is a lot that could be done to improve it, but it is still one of the top transit systems in North America, and a bargain at that.


New cars have been bought for the red line, those being the 01800's (#3 Red Line Car, mfg 1993/94 by Bombardier).
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Postby ctaman34 » Mon Oct 18, 2004 7:44 pm

CRail wrote:T has lousy management and is undergoing a lot of modernizing projects which can make your commute a nightmare.

There are many major projects underway:

Red Line:
South Station Reconstruction
Charles/MGH reconstruction
Ashmont line work

Green Line:
Superstation
Elevated demolition

blue line
bowdoin restoration
new heavy rail cars


On the green line section, you forgot about the arborway trolley restoration.
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Postby N.Y. State Of Mind » Mon Oct 18, 2004 8:10 pm

If you think tha T sucks, then go to here:
www.badtransit.com
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Postby Robert Paniagua » Tue Oct 19, 2004 6:00 am

I've already seen that website, and believe me, I have to agree with it too, it's practically accurate about saying that the MBTA is "bad transit" after all :-).
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