Remembering the 01400s

Discussion relating to commuter rail, light rail, and subway operations of the MBTA.

Moderators: CRail, sery2831

Re: Remembering the 01400s

Postby MBTA3247 » Wed Jun 16, 2010 8:09 pm

The 01400s were on the side of the yard closest to the Old Colony tracks 2 weeks ago.
"The destination of this train is [BEEP BEEP]" -announcement on an Ashmont train.
User avatar
MBTA3247
 
Posts: 2608
Joined: Tue Jul 11, 2006 6:01 pm
Location: Milton

Re: Remembering the 01400s

Postby atsf sp » Wed Jun 16, 2010 9:15 pm

Go to the park at the end of the post office at the old draw. it is right next to the yard and the 1400s are usually parked at the end of the track.
"Why would you take a train to go see another train?"
Some people just don't understand.
My Photos
atsf sp
 
Posts: 2169
Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2007 7:00 pm

Re: Remembering the 01400s

Postby RailBus63 » Thu Jan 13, 2011 9:28 am

Bumping this thread to continue a side discussion that was started in the Type 9 thread:

F-line to Dudley via Park wrote:
Buy a tried-and-true design from a tried-and-true manufacturer and you save money over the long haul, even if they're not the low bidder.


The Red Line Pullmans are 42 years old, and 25 years past their rebuild. They're starting to fail now but have been very reliable and have seen little out-of-service time despite the punishing toll such a long line takes on them. So reliable that 20 years later they got a whole order of exact lookalike/workalikes ordered. By the time they're retired mid-decade they'll have surpassed all but the original Red Line 0600's (1911-1963) and the original Blue Line 0500's (1924-1980) in heavy-rail car longevity, and will hold the Boston transit odometer record for mileage traveled (even more than the PCC's).

What's the common thread? The Hawkers were a totally off-the-shelf design taken from PATH cars (equally long-lived!) with only slight carbody mods for the OL and BL dimensions. The 01500/01600's were a back-to-basics model after Pullman overreached with a new "modern" design on the 01400's that proved to be unreliable and hard-to-maintain over the long term. The carbody borrowed from the modern vehicles, the guts from an update of the bulletproof PCC heavy-rail spec...exactly like the Type 7's did after the Boeing debacle. When money's hard to come by, an investment in proven technology pays for itself over time. The T's done it before. They can do it again by resisting the urge to over-customize. We don't need bleeding-edge. We need something that Just Works...for decades on end.


Were the 01400's really a design that P-S 'overreached on? I always considered them a big 01100 that was sadly missing too much of the sound-proofing material of the Main Line El cars. They were a workhorse for the first 20 years on the Ashmont branch, and the Red Line managers I knew back in the 1980's had no concerns at all about mixing in 01400’s in large numbers on the South Shore branch at all hours starting in 1981. Based on discussions over the years with management and others with inside information, the later reliability issues were largely centered around the retrofitted ATO equipment and difficulties getting that to work properly with the otherwise older design of the cars (remember, the 01500/01600's were designed from the start to be equipped with cab signaling). I would certainly argue that the 01400’s “just worked … for decades”.
User avatar
RailBus63
 
Posts: 1872
Joined: Tue May 04, 2004 1:48 pm

Re: Remembering the 01400s

Postby Robert Paniagua » Thu Jan 13, 2011 1:27 pm

Well, the 01400 work train is still doing good, hopefully it'll be preserved for many years to come and NOT get scrapped
~Robert Paniagua
Moderator: WMATA :: General Railroad Operations
User avatar
Robert Paniagua
 
Posts: 4418
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 6:11 am
Location: Weymouth, MA 02188

Re: Remembering the 01400s

Postby F-line to Dudley via Park » Thu Jan 13, 2011 8:27 pm

Robert Paniagua wrote:Well, the 01400 work train is still doing good, hopefully it'll be preserved for many years to come and NOT get scrapped


Unlikely, because with the 01500/01600 retirements coming they're going to have an influx of potential work car conversions and a whole generation's worth of spare parts. It will help a lot on the maintenance end to use those as work motors instead because the workalike 01700's are still going to be in revenue service for at least another 10-15 years after the new car order. The common part source between makes would lengthen the 15/16's work car lifespan that much more than if the whole car generation were retired like the 01400's were. Plus the 01500's can be decoupled and run as single units, giving much more flexible options to make different types of work cars out of them. If they need a powered flatcar or crane car or something of that ilk they could easily slice one up into whatever they needed at much lower cost than building new.

The good news is that these 4 are unlikely to meet the scrapper's torch. Some museum will snap them up because of their relative rarity. The only real work they'd need to run as a museum piece would be some interior cleanup and seating area repair since they obviously haven't been kept "passenger-clean" hauling trash, equipment, and MOW crews around almost every night for 17 years.
F-line to Dudley via Park
 
Posts: 7218
Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2005 7:26 pm
Location: North Cambridge

Re: Remembering the 01400s

Postby diburning » Thu Jan 13, 2011 11:59 pm

Maybe Seashore will pick them up? (Although I think they already have a pair)
User avatar
diburning
 
Posts: 2975
Joined: Sat Feb 09, 2008 7:37 pm
Location: Practicing safe CSX by using Three-Step Protection

Re: Remembering the 01400s

Postby daylight4449 » Fri Jan 14, 2011 7:08 am

diburning wrote:Maybe Seashore will pick them up? (Although I think they already have a pair)

i don't know. i think they have old blue and orange line cars, but i think they were earlier than the 01400s
User avatar
daylight4449
 
Posts: 1552
Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2008 6:48 pm
Location: Leicester, MA

Re: Remembering the 01400s

Postby F-line to Dudley via Park » Fri Jan 14, 2011 12:59 pm

daylight4449 wrote:
diburning wrote:Maybe Seashore will pick them up? (Although I think they already have a pair)

i don't know. i think they have old blue and orange line cars, but i think they were earlier than the 01400s


Seashore has 01450/01455.
F-line to Dudley via Park
 
Posts: 7218
Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2005 7:26 pm
Location: North Cambridge

Re: Remembering the 01400s

Postby octr202 » Fri Jan 14, 2011 1:27 pm

And no where to put another four car set.
Wondering if I'll see the Haverhill double-tracking finished before I retire...
Photo: Melbourne W7 No. 1019 on Route 78, Bridge & Church Streets, Richmond, Victoria. 10/21/2010
User avatar
octr202
 
Posts: 4142
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 8:13 am
Location: In the land of the once and future 73 trackless trolley.

Re: Remembering the 01400s

Postby 3rdrail » Fri Jan 14, 2011 4:38 pm

Scrap the pieces of junk. They were the worst product that Pullman ever put out, they're ugly, run crappy, are of an era which most museums have numerous R/T stock, and what I hold most against them...they replaced some of the coolest R/T ever in Boston - the 06/0700's ! (The only decent thing that they ever had was their original paint scheme with the gold widening band in front - even that got ruined !)
~Paul Joyce~
[i]Moderator: Toy Trains, Model Railroading, Outdoor and Live Steam

Paul Joyce passed away in August, 2013. We honor his memory and his devotion at railroad.net.
User avatar
3rdrail
 
Posts: 5641
Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2006 11:10 pm
Location: Boston

Re: Remembering the 01400s

Postby R36 Combine Coach » Fri Jan 14, 2011 4:55 pm

3rdrail wrote:Scrap the pieces of junk. They were the worst product that Pullman ever put out, they're ugly, run crappy, are of an era which most museums have numerous R/T stock, and what I hold most against them.

The worst Pullman product more would agree on would be the CTA 2000s (delivered around the same as the 01400s) or the R46s (although they have much more reliable in recent years).
Since my friend continues to chain smoke nonstop, she is probably an Alco.
User avatar
R36 Combine Coach
 
Posts: 4891
Joined: Mon Jun 09, 2008 8:51 pm

Re: Remembering the 01400s

Postby 3rdrail » Fri Jan 14, 2011 5:56 pm

Seems like they just didn't care with the 01400's, which is a shame because they put together some legends in Boston that couldn't be killed- even when the T wanted them to die (0500's/01100's). With them, it was a mutual case of apathy. Both Pullman-Standard and the MTA (which was about ready to jump ship) really didn't care. That, and the fact that (not Pullman's fault) that their performance lacked after the ATO retro-fitting. Yech ! Melt 'em down, then send 'em to Siemens and make up some nice Main Line No. 13 cars for the Needham Extension !
~Paul Joyce~
[i]Moderator: Toy Trains, Model Railroading, Outdoor and Live Steam

Paul Joyce passed away in August, 2013. We honor his memory and his devotion at railroad.net.
User avatar
3rdrail
 
Posts: 5641
Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2006 11:10 pm
Location: Boston

Re: Remembering the 01400s

Postby typesix » Fri Jan 14, 2011 7:35 pm

Yeah, complete opposite of the nice 01100s of only several years before.
typesix
 
Posts: 629
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 11:23 am
Location: Boston

Re: Remembering the 01400s

Postby 3rdrail » Sat Jan 15, 2011 2:26 am

Oh yeah, those 01100's were up there forty feet on the iron in the middle of blizzards with little protection from the elements, run constantly, subjected to hairpin curves at Dudley - North Station x2 - Sullivan Sq., over bridges, in the tunnel, they'd sit at the Cathedral curve on a banked curve without so much as a groan. I have photos on this site of an 01100 among new 01200's - you would have a hard time telling the difference if you didn't know their fine details ! And then there were the Eastie 0500's. What a tremendous set. They lasted 57 years and were the cars that got brought out in blizzards because the newer cars would break down and they wouldn't ! Once again, a photo shows them in a three generation line-up at their end looking like they were ready for another 57 years ! Make no mistake - when they wanted to, Pullman could put out one hell of a product !
~Paul Joyce~
[i]Moderator: Toy Trains, Model Railroading, Outdoor and Live Steam

Paul Joyce passed away in August, 2013. We honor his memory and his devotion at railroad.net.
User avatar
3rdrail
 
Posts: 5641
Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2006 11:10 pm
Location: Boston

Re: Remembering the 01400s

Postby Robert Paniagua » Sat Jan 15, 2011 9:10 am

F-line to Dudley via Park wrote:Unlikely, because with the 01500/01600 retirements coming they're going to have an influx of potential work car conversions and a whole generation's worth of spare parts. It will help a lot on the maintenance end to use those as work motors instead because the workalike 01700's are still going to be in revenue service for at least another 10-15 years after the new car order. The common part source between makes would lengthen the 15/16's work car lifespan that much more than if the whole car generation were retired like the 01400's were. Plus the 01500's can be decoupled and run as single units, giving much more flexible options to make different types of work cars out of them. If they need a powered flatcar or crane car or something of that ilk they could easily slice one up into whatever they needed at much lower cost than building new.


You're likely right about that, just like the situation in New York's B Division with the R32s and R42s which like the 015/1600s will be good maintenance fleet cars

F-line to Dudley via Park wrote:The good news is that these 4 are unlikely to meet the scrapper's torch. Some museum will snap them up because of their relative rarity. The only real work they'd need to run as a museum piece would be some interior cleanup and seating area repair since they obviously haven't been kept "passenger-clean" hauling trash, equipment, and MOW crews around almost every night for 17 years.


Yeah, there you go, that would be ideal. Shore Line (Connecticut) Trolley Museum could take them, since I really liked them, so that would be cool for such museums to take them
~Robert Paniagua
Moderator: WMATA :: General Railroad Operations
User avatar
Robert Paniagua
 
Posts: 4418
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 6:11 am
Location: Weymouth, MA 02188

PreviousNext

Return to Massachusetts Bay Transportation Authority (MBTA)

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Exabot [Bot] and 3 guests