Greenline Expansion to Medford

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Greenline Expansion to Medford

Postby atkelly » Fri Mar 12, 2004 1:46 pm

http://www.boston.com/news/local/articles/2004/03/12/study_to_explore_extension_routes_for_green_line/

Here is the Globe article. Project is currently billed at $89 Million dollars a mile.
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Postby jdreed » Fri Mar 12, 2004 2:42 pm

Too bad the 5 year plan only budgetted for the study :-(
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A or F?

Postby mharter » Fri Mar 12, 2004 6:22 pm

What letter will it be?
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Postby jwhite07 » Fri Mar 12, 2004 8:22 pm

As an "inbound" destination of one of the existing lines, it probably wouldn't have a route letter assigned. Just as Lechmere doesn't. But if it is going to be operated as a separate route... i.e. West Medford - Government Center (Brattle Loop), it probably would be given a letter.

F would be the logical assumption, but who knows -- by the time this apparent no-brainer finally gets out of the "planning and study" stage, the F designation may have already been given to the long-sought Washington Street light rail branch!! :wink: Yeah, right.
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Postby MBTA F40PH-2C 1050 » Sat Mar 13, 2004 9:02 am

89 million for one mile!!! that is expensive, i wonder if that is the same price for commuter rail? probably not though, does any1 know?
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Postby I.M. Judge » Sat Mar 13, 2004 4:17 pm

I wonder if that price would come down if the 'Lowell Line" option was chosen over the tunnel - I would think that the tunnel would be much more expensive.

One thing I am personally tired of hearing in the articles about this project, both in the Globe and in the Somerville Journal, etc, is the way someone is always saying Somerville only has one T station. While this is certainly true, no one points out that Porter Sq., Sullivan Sq., and Lechmere are all right over the city line and serve Somerville too. I think that all communities could use more public transportation, but it is not as if Somerville is totally desperate for more service. All of this IMHO, of course.

Glad to see that someone is covering the fact that the silver lie should be light rail.
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Postby efin98 » Sat Mar 13, 2004 6:13 pm

The tunnel has the biggest impact on ridership numbers as it hits an area that does not get service if the trains travel by way of the commuter rail right of way. Also I don't think the Lowell Line is wide enough to support light rail tracks at all, it looks at places to barely be able to handle two commuter rail tracks.
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Postby jrc520 » Sat Mar 13, 2004 6:20 pm

lowell line can handle it. West Medford is the end though. after that, it gets tight. too tight. but there is plenty of room otherwise.
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Postby octr202 » Sat Mar 13, 2004 9:30 pm

My biggest fear regarding this project is the cost of that tunnel. If Somerville is too insistant on having the full tunnel Union Sq. routing, it may sink the entire project. The distance from a station on the Lowell ROW at Washington St. to Union Sq. is not that great...better to have the line built via the Lowell ROW than spend decades squabbling over how to pay for the tunnel that might never get built.
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Postby MBTAFan » Sat Mar 13, 2004 9:56 pm

jwhite07 wrote:As an "inbound" destination of one of the existing lines, it probably wouldn't have a route letter assigned. Just as Lechmere doesn't. But if it is going to be operated as a separate route... i.e. West Medford - Government Center (Brattle Loop), it probably would be given a letter.

F would be the logical assumption, but who knows -- by the time this apparent no-brainer finally gets out of the "planning and study" stage, the F designation may have already been given to the long-sought Washington Street light rail branch!! :wink: Yeah, right.


Yeah I would reserve F for Washington St. I would personally rather seen them refer to it as the A Line if they were to use a letter designation for West Medford. It would at least balance out the existing current lettering scheme and wouldn't be a problem since the old A Line is never coming back...

A West Medford
B Boston College
C Cleveland Circle
D Riverside
E Arborway (fully restored Arborway)
F Dudley (Silver Lie converted to light rail via old Tremont St tunnel to Boylston)

At least that's what an ideal world would look like. And the letters would make sense too!
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Green Line

Postby GP40MC1118 » Sat Mar 13, 2004 9:57 pm

IMHO, one big problem not mentioned in the Union Square routing is
the area between the former B&M Yard 8/7 "Red Bridge" and Medford
Street. What's the problem? Well you have to figure out a way to get
over or under McGrath Highway and CSX's Grand Jct Branch at
Swift Interlocking.

You can't have a grade level crossing of the Green Line and CSX's
Grand Jct (which crosses the T's Fitchburg Route mainline at grade
under McGrath). And there's no room anyway. This leaves some
sort of viaduct/bridge over McGrath and the Fitch. Don't think
that's going to fly.

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Postby ceo » Tue Mar 16, 2004 6:30 pm

The place along the route that most needs the service is Union Square. I think it makes by far the most sense to extend the Green Line there along the Fitchburg, and leave open the possibility of a future extension to West Medford via a Prospect Hill tunnel or a branch.The Tufts kids can walk to Davis, and West Medford has the commuter rail. If the route is just built out the Lowell Line, that's too far from Union Square to effectively serve that population.

IMHO, one big problem not mentioned in the Union Square routing is
the area between the former B&M Yard 8/7 "Red Bridge" and Medford
Street. What's the problem? Well you have to figure out a way to get
over or under McGrath Highway and CSX's Grand Jct Branch at
Swift Interlocking.


Hmmm. If you want to be able to extend the line under Prospect Hill, the Green Line will have to be on the north side of the Fitchburg Line anyway. Take down the Red Bridge and put in a viaduct, using part of the bridge's approach embankment. Biggest problem I see is that the Fitchburg ROW may not be wide enough.
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Union^2

Postby jdreed » Tue Mar 16, 2004 8:34 pm

ceo wrote:The place along the route that most needs the service is Union Square.


Amen to that. Of course, if Somerville were more pedestrian friendly, it'd be less of a Problem to walk from the Lowell Line. But with the McGrath right there, Union Square is essentially cut off from the Lowell Line. Sure, there are sidewalks, but the highway presents a real visual obstacle in addition to a physical one - People aren't going to go out for a stroll under a highway if they can avoid it. Somerville seems all gung-ho on Union Square being the new center of town - if they mean that, at the very least they need to harass the T about getting CR service to Union Square restored and the McGrath needs to disappear, or become a cut with wide bridges over it. But I'm getting off topic. And as long as I'm dreaming, I'd like a million bucks.
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Postby Charliemta » Tue Mar 16, 2004 11:38 pm

A cost effective alternative that would establish a Green line station right at Union Square, and also avoid costly tunnel construction under Prospect Hill, would be to construct two branches:

One branch would go from the new Lechmere sation along the north side of the Fitchburg line to Union Square, and terminate there.

The other branch would go from the new Lechmere station along the Lowell Branch to West Medford.

There are enough Green lines converging into Park St. from the south to continue on north to split at the two branch lines: one to Union Square and one to West Medford.
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Postby trainhq » Wed Mar 17, 2004 3:26 pm

I think the branched line, with one of the branches to Union Square and
the other to West Medford, is one of the study options. I think it makes
more sense than building the expensive tunnel from Union Square to
the Lowell Line. Remember, Union Square is already slated to get
a commuter rail station on the Fitchburg line too; there's no reason
why they have to have both that and a Green Line connection to
West Medford too. It would be nice, but for the $$$ I don't think it
can be justified, since you're already making Union Square accessible
from both the West on Commuter rail and all the other branches of the Green Line. The people living in the area who want to commute downtown
won't complain either.
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