Keolis Commuter Service New Operator of the CR Discussion

Discussion relating to commuter rail, light rail, and subway operations of the MBTA.

Moderators: CRail, sery2831

Re: Keolis Commuter Service Wins CR for 8 Years

Postby GE45tonner » Sun Jan 26, 2014 8:11 pm

octr202 wrote:I skimmed the end of that thread (hint, it's in the Florida East Coast forum if you're looking for it). Is there anything to that other than the SNCF Holocaust issue that we've already been through here? Anything relative to their qualifications as a passenger rail operator today?


I have heard their relations with labor have not been that fantastic, that may be worth mentioning...
"Clear back three cars to the Admiral"
GE45tonner
 
Posts: 173
Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2011 4:50 pm
Location: Rhode Island

Re: Keolis Commuter Service Wins CR for 8 Years

Postby BandA » Mon Feb 03, 2014 1:09 pm

in Winter 2014 Discussion for Commuter Rail Delays and Storms http://railroad.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=65&t=153726
jbvb wrote:Last weekend I got an earfull from an operating employee about MBCR trying to skimp on maintenance, such that equipment reported with cab signal failures was assigned for another run rather than being fixed, repeated HEP failures on consecutive days due to consists that weren't repaired overnight, etc. These stories were from the Old Colony the week of the 20th.
This raised some questions in my mind that are more appropriate for this thread. 1) Is MBCR management purposely sabotaging maintenance, or 2) Is MBCR just understaffing maintenance? 3) Are repairs supposedly being made but not actually done?

Should the MBTA kick MBCR out early & bring in Keolis on an emergency basis at BET or systemwide?
User avatar
BandA
 
Posts: 1899
Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2012 11:47 am

Re: Keolis Commuter Service Wins CR for 8 Years

Postby jscola30 » Wed Feb 05, 2014 2:13 am

yea I have T alerts for the Old Colony/Greenbush trains, that week there were lots of delays. I love it when pettiness comes before paying customers.
jscola30
 
Posts: 779
Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2005 12:18 am

Re: Keolis Commuter Service Wins CR for 8 Years

Postby CRail » Wed Feb 05, 2014 11:21 am

The "paying customer" is not the priority. You think you are, you think you should be, but you are not and should not be the priority. A transportation agency/company's job is to get the service over the road. Whether or not you are on it, have paid, got to wherever you were going, etc., makes no difference so long as the trip was run as close to the advertised timetable as possible. Their purpose is to serve the ridership, not the rider. If that were the mindset adopted by both the MBTA and its contractors, the service would drastically improve. Instead, by trying to please every "paying customer," they end up pleasing nobody.

Finally, as an off to the side note which is to provoke some thought rather than generate off topic replies, the passengers of any publicly operated (as opposed to privately operated and without subsidy) transportation service do not pay for the service they're getting. Sure, they pitch in a bit, but so doesn't everyone else in the state. I don't mind helping to pay for it as I use things that other people help to pay for, but it irks me when people demand a certain level of service on the basis of entitlement because "I'm paying for it." Unless you're paying at least $20-$50 per ride to Boston, you certainly aren't!
I welcome responses to this, but not in this thread as it will lead to locks and/or deletions (rightfully so). Simply send me a PM or quote this in a new or relevant thread as there's a lot more I can say in regards to the subject.
Moderator: Massachusetts Bay Transportation Authority
Avatar:3679A (since wrecked)/3623B (now in service as 3636B).
User avatar
CRail
 
Posts: 2132
Joined: Tue May 18, 2004 8:27 am
Location: Eastie

MBTA to appeal Keolis Commuter Service contract

Postby beautifulplanet » Fri Feb 07, 2014 5:54 am

Losing bidder for commuter rail contract to appeal
By Martine Powers | Globe staff February 07, 2014


See here: http://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2014/02/07/mbcr-file-protest-over-awarding-commuter-rail-contract-newcomer/QNlOqwen3aTj68WQerGczN/story.html
beautifulplanet
 
Posts: 3
Joined: Tue Jan 28, 2014 4:55 pm

Re: MBTA to appeal Keolis Commuter Service contract

Postby F-line to Dudley via Park » Fri Feb 07, 2014 11:01 am

beautifulplanet wrote:Losing bidder for commuter rail contract to appeal
By Martine Powers | Globe staff February 07, 2014


See here: http://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2014/02/07/mbcr-file-protest-over-awarding-commuter-rail-contract-newcomer/QNlOqwen3aTj68WQerGczN/story.html


Yup. Operation Chaos is underway. If MBCR can't have the contract, they intend to make sure nobody can come July 1.
F-line to Dudley via Park
 
Posts: 7233
Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2005 7:26 pm
Location: North Cambridge

Re: Keolis Commuter Service Wins CR for 8 Years

Postby Komarovsky » Fri Feb 07, 2014 6:02 pm

So presumably if they get a restraining order, commuter rail won't run....... Glad I've got a bike, it's going to be quicker to bike to Boston than drive if that happens.
Komarovsky
 
Posts: 483
Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2011 10:11 pm

Re: Keolis Commuter Service Wins CR for 8 Years

Postby BandA » Fri Feb 07, 2014 7:03 pm

Hope the MBTA doesn't settle with MBCR. In fact they should find some reasons to countersue, or threaten to terminate the contract early.
User avatar
BandA
 
Posts: 1899
Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2012 11:47 am

Re: Keolis Commuter Service Wins CR for 8 Years

Postby Tom Barker » Fri Feb 07, 2014 8:09 pm

One thing about he MBTA , they spend vast amounts of money rather than admit they may have made a bad decision.
Some recent examples are Rotem coaches, LRV (Breda?), busses (Navi?), locomotive procurement appealed and won by Motive Power.

I am sure there are others, if you have been around here long enough can supply others.

Check out some of the evaluation documents at http://mbta.com/business_center/bidding ... p?id=26241

The scoring seems to be biased towards Keolis.

Lets see how this passion play ends..
Tom Barker
 
Posts: 3
Joined: Fri Jan 17, 2014 8:04 pm

Re: Keolis Commuter Service Wins CR for 8 Years

Postby octr202 » Sat Feb 08, 2014 11:46 am

Komarovsky wrote:So presumably if they get a restraining order, commuter rail won't run....... Glad I've got a bike, it's going to be quicker to bike to Boston than drive if that happens.


While that might be the practical outcome (I'm employing sarcasm here), if an injunction is granted, this goes to a trial, and that trial occurs or stretches past July 1, the court order would no doubt include language that MBCR is to continue operating the system. Daily service would continue, although I can't imagine it'd be of very high quality when you have a contractor and client who are in the midst of a lawsuit.
Wondering if I'll see the Haverhill double-tracking finished before I retire...
Photo: Melbourne W7 No. 1019 on Route 78, Bridge & Church Streets, Richmond, Victoria. 10/21/2010
User avatar
octr202
 
Posts: 4142
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 8:13 am
Location: In the land of the once and future 73 trackless trolley.

Re: Keolis Commuter Service Wins CR for 8 Years

Postby diburning » Sat Feb 08, 2014 6:39 pm

So, if the legal mess drags beyond July 1st, how will things be done? WIll MBCR be operating under a contract extension, or will they bill the MBTA for services (and have the opportunity to charge higher fees), or will they have to negotiate an interim contract?
User avatar
diburning
 
Posts: 2975
Joined: Sat Feb 09, 2008 7:37 pm
Location: Practicing safe CSX by using Three-Step Protection

Re: Keolis Commuter Service Wins CR for 8 Years

Postby BandA » Sun Feb 09, 2014 12:20 am

diburning wrote:So, if the legal mess drags beyond July 1st, how will things be done? WIll MBCR be operating under a contract extension, or will they bill the MBTA for services (and have the opportunity to charge higher fees), or will they have to negotiate an interim contract?
I suppose the "T" could temporarily take direct control, hiring Keolis managers as temporary employees. The existing contract ends June 30th, n'est pas? The new contract is in dispute, I don't see how a judge would have the right to extend an existing contract, only able to prevent a new contract from going into effect.

If Keolis does an exceptional job, after a couple of years the "T" should outsource subway operations to them too.

I am not affiliated with Keolis or MBCR; I have been influenced by the data in the Keolis documents comparing MBCR reliability to other systems.

The new vendor is supposed to hire the existing workforce. How does the "T" or the new vendor pry loose Payroll and Personel records ("Hu-man Resources" as the Ferenge would say) from an angry MBCR?
User avatar
BandA
 
Posts: 1899
Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2012 11:47 am

Re: Keolis Commuter Service Wins CR for 8 Years

Postby ST214 » Sun Feb 09, 2014 12:54 am

This really is turning into a mess. MBCR is not helping their cause by acting like this. Crappy service + declining ridership= a loss of employment(contract). That is how business works. This was bound to happen, no matter who was the other bidder was. I think the T board would have even taken Amtrak back if they bid on it!

When this is all said and done, the T BETTER sue MBCR to cover all legal costs. There is NO REASON my tax dollars should have to pay for this because MBCR is upset that they lost the contract. They dug their own hole, now they need to go lie in it.

Sorry, but as a taxpayer, this legal temper tantrum is really starting to tick me off.

Please note I am not ragging on MBCR field personnel. Management is the issue.
Hoping for a rebirth of the Screamer fleet.
User avatar
ST214
 
Posts: 1474
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 6:49 pm
Location: Cleveland Heights, OH

Re: Keolis Commuter Service Wins CR for 8 Years

Postby wicked » Sun Feb 09, 2014 5:26 am

Doesn't the losing party typically have to pay all court costs in civil action, which this is?
wicked
 
Posts: 440
Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2012 1:17 pm
Location: MBTA Red Line, formerly WMATA Blue/Yellow

Re: Keolis Commuter Service Wins CR for 8 Years

Postby F-line to Dudley via Park » Sun Feb 09, 2014 1:08 pm

ST214 wrote:This really is turning into a mess. MBCR is not helping their cause by acting like this. Crappy service + declining ridership= a loss of employment(contract). That is how business works. This was bound to happen, no matter who was the other bidder was. I think the T board would have even taken Amtrak back if they bid on it!

When this is all said and done, the T BETTER sue MBCR to cover all legal costs. There is NO REASON my tax dollars should have to pay for this because MBCR is upset that they lost the contract. They dug their own hole, now they need to go lie in it.

Sorry, but as a taxpayer, this legal temper tantrum is really starting to tick me off.

Please note I am not ragging on MBCR field personnel. Management is the issue.


This is a problem of having a bidder that was formed for the sole purpose of acquiring one contract. While Veolia, Bombardier, and Alt. Concepts all have plenty of business independently...this was it for the soon-to-be-disbanded partnership. So we've arrived in the situation where they basically have nothing to lose by making everyone's lives miserable out of spite and trying to hurt the state with a costly disruption in the transition. While it's not going to reflect all that well on each of the partners...they only do business here as "MBCR" so the fallout of it getting ugly for Veolia, Bombardier, AC is limited. Counterintuitively, even massive Veolia is sort of shielded from fallout because losing Metrolink and the T in under 5 years has more or less put them on the sidelines--nursing multiple black eyes--as a major player in U.S. commuter rail, probably forcing them to retrench for awhile into their bus and rapid transit contract business. If they've already determined they see more domestic growth potential there for the rest of this decade, it's not going to bother them that their commuter rail rep is in tatters.

That's just a ridiculously risky place to be. I don't know how the state could've been so careless a decade ago to not see the risk of this very scenario playing out, but when all's said and done there hopefully will be some reform protecting against these kinds of "nothing left to lose but watch the world burn"-type single purpose consortium bidders abusing the exit terms of the contract. At any level of state contract bidding.
F-line to Dudley via Park
 
Posts: 7233
Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2005 7:26 pm
Location: North Cambridge

PreviousNext

Return to Massachusetts Bay Transportation Authority (MBTA)

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 10 guests